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 Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion

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Athorment
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PostSubject: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Feb 07, 2016 2:20 pm

Hello everyone, this is my first topic/thread so please do give pointers if I mess up somewhere. Thanks in advance and i hope we all can have fun with this.

As you all know, the current "Alt" characters available are: Weegee (Luigi), Evil Ryu (Ryu), Zero Suit Samus (Samus), Pichu (Pikachu) and Dr. Mario (Mario).

Now, we can't exactly use Weegee as an example cause he was added when the old dev team was around... but we do effectively have 3 types of "Alts":
*The same "character" with a lot of similarities, but retooled with different moves or properties. (Dr. Mario and Evil Ryu)
*The Actual Same Character, but using a completely different moveset. Either because of gaining or losing a well known tool. (Varia Suit Samus Vs Zero Suit Samus)
*A Different character that is still considered on the lines of the original. (Pichu Vs Pikachu)
**EDIT: It has since been confirmed by Mp3 Toaster and Dustination that "Different" characters won't be alts (i.e. Diddy and Dixie Kong)

This begs the following questions for the topic:
1) Which Characters do you think could make potential "Alts"?
2) Which ones you would you like to see even if they are made "Alts"?
3) Which characters you DON'T approve of, but wouldn't mind (as much) to see as "Alts"?

It would be great if you could also add the reason why you could see them as Alts, as well as what they could potentially bring to the table (A different moveset like in the case of Zero Suit Samus, Different properties like Dr. Mario or even pleasing a fanbase with their fame like Vegeta or Pichu)

I think 5 characters is a good number, but feel free to mention as many as you'd like. What i want to avoid is people posting lists with empty reasoning like "Oh, i can see A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, J, K, L and M as characters" and leaving it like that

**Remember! This topic is not discussing whether or not these Alts have a "Fair shot at making it in"! Hence the title Dream/Wishlist, we are not here to discuss if they will be added but what they could provide as an Alt.

To start, here is what i think:

*Dixie Kong. In the brawl days everyone always mentioned how her hair could make her different from Diddy kong... truth be told? I don't think it will do much beyond decloning her.
Sure, she will whip her hair around for a few attacks, but what else can she do? She can perform a monkey flip, Clap, use her hands/feet/tail... all Diddy can do minus the peanut popgun and rocket barrel? I believe her popularity can earn her a spot as an Alt rather than a full character slot. Some more familiar with her may also be able to dig more beyond "Hair powers".
See her Topic Thread here: Dixie Kong (Donkey Kong Country) Discussion


*Dark Pit. Despite being a clone in sm4sh, he has decent support an ideas on his Topic Thread to possibly justify him as an Alt for Pit (Who still needs to be added too). Some of the ideas bring the fact that he could potentially use other weapons seen in Kid Icarus: Uprising to better represent the franchise's revival. Other suggestions involve making pit like either his Brawl or Even Project M version to have both the older and new Moveset playable in Crusade.
Dark Pit is also known for being the aggressive type, so it is highly believable to tweak some/most of his normals to posses single-hit properties or to change them in favor of more violent slashes.
See his Topic Thread here: Dark Pit (Kid Icarus: Uprising) Discussion

*Lucina. Unlike Dark Pit, She was met with more opposition. It is unclear (but probable) if some of the oppositors are just upset because she takes a Clone Slot. Even more interesting is the fact that they feel Roy is more justified as a sm4sh semi-clone, but even him is getting comments about further decloning him. Despite the Opposition, Lucina can be retooled and/or even take from the skills seen in Awakening.
There isn't a moveset everyone agrees on for her at the moment, but her popularity is definitively there with heated discussions between supporters and the opposition. Because of this, regardless of how much she can be decloned... i can see her as a Marth Alt regardless.
See her Topic Thread here: Lucina (Fire Emblem: Awakening) Discussion


Please Discuss respectfully and share your opinions! C:

P.D. I might make a list of well-argumented suggested alts under a spoiler section if this works.

List of Dream/Wishlist Character Alts:
 


Last edited by Athorment on Mon Feb 08, 2016 12:20 pm; edited 7 times in total (Reason for editing : Added Blood Falcon, Link (HW) and Male Wii Fit Trainer to Spoiler List)
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Feb 07, 2016 2:24 pm

It's important to note that a character alt still has to be that character, so Lucina can't really be a Marth alt.
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Athorment
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Feb 07, 2016 2:25 pm

Souji Seta wrote:
It's important to note that a character alt still has to be that character, so Lucina can't really be a Marth alt.

Source where the Dev team confirms that, plz?
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Feb 07, 2016 2:54 pm

No direct source, but as a main dev. I can confirm that this is the case. Alts being a completely different character won't excatly happen.

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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Feb 07, 2016 3:07 pm

I'll say it here because it seems to be one of the most common misconceptions: Ninten can't be a Ness alt

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Athorment
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Feb 07, 2016 5:02 pm

Edited the post to reflect this confirmation. Thank you (:
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Roy
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Feb 07, 2016 6:02 pm

Can Lucina be an alt? She did call herself Marth at the start of Awakening, but she's not actually Marth (a decendent, sure).

As for another character, I think X currently has quite a bit of support as a Mega Man alt. Has a lot of potential for a unique moveset (I have a topic for him) and represents a significant spin-off (?) of the Mega Man games.
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Feb 07, 2016 6:19 pm

Nope. She and Marth aren't one and the same, like Ninten and Ness, like Dust already said.
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:08 pm

Not going to let this post drive into Lucina derailment fam

Big Boss: I love Big Boss, and not only could he have his awesome gadgets and arsenal, he could bring an intense CQC-based moveset much different from Snakes. He's one of my most wanted overall characters.

Ganon: I think he'd be a Ganondorf alt though I'm not too sure. I'd love to see Ganon, with his trident/magic based gameplay and a cool heavyweight. Plus, more villains is always great, especially one as iconic as Ganon.

Yarn Yoshi: Bedoop has convinced me this would be an excellent idea though I wanted him anyways. I'd love to see the incorporation of yarn, transformations, and beads into Yarn Yoshi's movesets. Plus, I love the character.


Really those are the only 3 I can think of. I don't think either are too out of the realm out of the possibility, luckily!
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Feb 07, 2016 10:43 pm

Alongside Yarn Yoshi, I'd suggest Yarn Kirby. No copy abilities, but he'd have a tether and other grapple shenanigans.

Bros alts for Mario and Luigi with some hammer-based Smashes and some stuff based on the Bros. Moves and the Bros. Items from the Mario & Luigi games could be interesting.

And maybe a Meta Knight alt (Dark Meta Knight, perhaps?) with a moveset closer to the original Kirby games.
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Athorment
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Mon Feb 08, 2016 9:30 am

I only kept my Dixie kong and Lucina reasoning as examples of reasoning. Got them crossed out and even pointed out that different characters are not considered for alts.

Also started the Spoiler Listing with characters thus far including Name, Series, Who brought it up in this topic, as well as a link to an available Discussion thread if any.

Would also like to add a few Alts i thought of recently:

*Blood Falcon (F-Zero). As a long term Smash fan, I'm among the people who firmly believe Ganondorf has the potential to have his own moveset. I'm also among the fans who thought of Black Shadow as the most likely candidate to receive the now infamous "Falcon-dorf" moveset in order to continue "disrespecting" opponents with "Not-Warlock punch" and "Not-WizardFoot" (to state a few moves). However, Main developer Perfect Hell worked on an original moveset for Black Shadow as early as 2014 ( Black Shadow Discussion Thread ). This means that the "Falcon-dorf" moveset is not only in jeopardy, but also up for the taking.
With this history explained it's easy to see what I'm about to suggest: Give the Falcon-dorf moveset to Blood Falcon!

*Link (Hyrule Warriors). You might be wondering what a different incarnation of Link could provide (besides wearing a scarf). The answer is simple: Link limits himself to a strict Sword-focused fighting style that is not only flashy like an Anime protagonist, but also adds speed.
With Hyrule warriors Link NOT using the familiar items (Boomerang, Bow & Arrow, Clawshot, Bombs) in his general moveset (Rather as items that all HW characters can use), It is easy to see a Faster Link who can dish tones of damage with a decent range.
His moveset can also be mixed with more recent Link incarnations (Like Twilight Princess Link, but more specifically Skyward Sword Link) for a more agile version that can perform multi hit sword slashes. Examples of this vary from Skyward Sword's Vertical Spin Attack (Instead of the horizontal one) and the famous Skyward Strike, up to the Shield bash dash and Ground Stab that releases energy. If balance is believe an issue, all this "Dramatic Anime powers" could be implemented into a "Charge" mechanic where Link Must stop to lift his sword skyward, charge energy and Then he can slash around with better reach.

*Male Wii Fit Trainer (Wii Fit). This one came up as a funny addition on the Wii Fit Trainer Discussion. We were actually able to make a semi-clone set that has the Female using the yoga moves known in Sm4sh, while the Male Trainer uses more body building oriente normal attacks. Male Wii Fit Trainer doesn't have a discussion thread (It might not adequate to make one even, who knows), but it's still something worth checking as an Alt.
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Mon Feb 08, 2016 10:05 am

By the way Athor, Big Boss should just be Metal Gear. He debuted in Metal Gear 1.

I do like the Mario & Luigi idea, though who would it be an alt for? Mario or Luigi? Because they both already have alts.
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Athorment
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Mon Feb 08, 2016 10:34 am

I'll fix that next time there's an addition to the spoiler list then.

I think it would depend probably depend on what can be done with each. Mario is probably the go to given his slightly more relevant (People could argue that Mario used a Hammer first thanks to appearing in the original Donkey Kong). Besides, a new alt for Luigi could very well be a moveset focused on his Poltergust.

It's a good question though and just as interesting as: "Would Paper Mario be an Alt?" He has the same differences that Samus and Zero Suit have. Both are technically the same, albeit in completely different dispositions.
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Mon Feb 08, 2016 10:39 am

Paper Mario would be an alt yes

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Roy
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Mon Feb 08, 2016 10:41 am

Metal Sonic could be a good alternate for Sonic. He was created to essentially be Sonic, so I don't see any issue with this. As seen in his many incarnations, he has plenty of moveset potential to differentiate himself.

What about Mew for Mewtwo? Since Mewtwo is an actual clone of Mew, he is eligible to be an alt, and Mew has such a wide range of options for moveset.


2 questions for potential alts:

- Would a character the same species and the same origin be eligible? Toadette for Toad and Crunch for Crash are 2 good examples of this. While not technically the same character, they're similar enough that they might be valid.

- Would Gooey fit as a Kirby alt? I mean... when you play Dream Land 3, you create Gooey by taking health from Kirby, so it seems like this could work.
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:12 am

Roy wrote:
Metal Sonic could be a good alternate for Sonic. He was created to essentially be Sonic, so I don't see any issue with this. As seen in his many incarnations, he has plenty of moveset potential to differentiate himself.

What about Mew for Mewtwo? Since Mewtwo is an actual clone of Mew, he is eligible to be an alt, and Mew has such a wide range of options for moveset.


2 questions for potential alts:

- Would a character the same species and the same origin be eligible? Toadette for Toad and Crunch for Crash are 2 good examples of this. While not technically the same character, they're similar enough that they might be valid.

- Would Gooey fit as a Kirby alt? I mean... when you play Dream Land 3, you create Gooey by taking health from Kirby, so it seems like this could work.
Gooey would not be a Kirby alt. They're completely different characters. A simple game mechanic doesn't make an entirely different character an alt.

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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:55 am

Roy wrote:
Metal Sonic could be a good alternate for Sonic. He was created to essentially be Sonic, so I don't see any issue with this. As seen in his many incarnations, he has plenty of moveset potential to differentiate himself.

What about Mew for Mewtwo? Since Mewtwo is an actual clone of Mew, he is eligible to be an alt, and Mew has such a wide range of options for moveset.

2 questions for potential alts:

- Would a character the same species and the same origin be eligible? Toadette for Toad and Crunch for Crash are 2 good examples of this. While not technically the same character, they're similar enough that they might be valid.

- Would Gooey fit as a Kirby alt? I mean... when you play Dream Land 3, you create Gooey by taking health from Kirby, so it seems like this could work.

I believe it's: Yes to Metal Sonic, No/maybe to Mew, yes to Toadette as would probably be a Yes to Captain Toad too, I dont know who Crunch is, No to Gooey (But someone like Kabbi who is a yellow Kirby barely acknowledged anymore would)

Dustination wrote:
Paper Mario would be an alt, yes

Now that's pretty Interesting. Thank you Dust
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Mon Feb 08, 2016 1:02 pm

Gooey was just a question... was wondering if we could clear space on the main menu. Alright then. Crunch probably isn't an option, good to know.
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Athorment
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Thu Feb 11, 2016 7:21 am

Hmmm, i wonder if "Alternate fighting styles" would count as alts.
Like... some people want a decloned Roy with more fire and stuff, while others use the argument of "Roy being a (Semi) clone, and thus the one they want to see (Over Lucina)" which directly states there's support for Project M/Sm4sh style Roy.
Would something like "Melee Roy" (PM/Sm4sh) and "Crusade Roy" (Further decloned) be counted/considered as alts?
I mean, Mario with a hammer at least has both an aesthetic difference (Carrying the hammer) and is referencing an actual canon aspect of the character (Mario & Luigi RPG). So "Mario w/hammer" could have a stronger base of reason behind them than the Roy differentiation example i mention.
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Thu Feb 11, 2016 10:37 am

Young Link with Masks
Classic Sonic
Yarn Kirby/Prince Fluff
Paper Mario


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Roy
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:20 pm

Athorment wrote:
Hmmm, i wonder if "Alternate fighting styles" would count as alts.
Like... some people want a decloned Roy with more fire and stuff, while others use the argument of "Roy being a (Semi) clone, and thus the one they want to see (Over Lucina)" which directly states there's support for Project M/Sm4sh style Roy.
Would something like "Melee Roy" (PM/Sm4sh) and "Crusade Roy" (Further decloned) be counted/considered as alts?
I mean, Mario with a hammer at least has both an aesthetic difference (Carrying the hammer) and is referencing an actual canon aspect of the character (Mario & Luigi RPG). So "Mario w/hammer" could have a stronger base of reason behind them than the Roy differentiation example i mention.
I don't see why not. I mean, Ryu has an 'alt' just for a different final smash.

Of course, it's a lot more work than a single move... not sure the devs would be up for that. I don't think Mario w/hammer would get enough support (considering Paper Mario uses a hammer), but you're welcome to try.
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Thu Feb 11, 2016 3:44 pm

Roy wrote:

Of course, it's a lot more work than a single move... not sure the devs would be up for that. I don't think Mario w/hammer would get enough support (considering Paper Mario uses a hammer), but you're welcome to try.

Oh, that was just an example. I'm sure characters like Roy might not be up for that with a basis on support, but this discussion thread is not about chances... but possibility.
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Thu Jun 09, 2016 4:48 pm

The only alt I can think of that I would love to see is a Wii U Little Mac. I LOVE using him, but his Crusade moveset is very strange to me (If I recall, he was introduced a long time ago).
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Thu Jun 09, 2016 5:24 pm

wheeled_tank wrote:
The only alt I can think of that I would love to see is a Wii U Little Mac. I LOVE using him, but his Crusade moveset is very strange to me (If I recall, he was introduced a long time ago).
I think Super Punch-Out had a different Mac, one that was blonde.  I don't know if the current Little Mac sprites are final, but if not, then new Little Mac can take his Wii U set, and the blonde Mac can take Mac's current Crusade set.

That's one solution, anyway. Another is Wire Frame Mac.
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sat Jun 18, 2016 6:50 pm

Shadow Lady from MvC for Chun-Li. 'Nuff said.

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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sat Jun 18, 2016 10:35 pm

Valentine221 wrote:
Shadow Lady from MvC for Chun-Li. 'Nuff said.

Kung-Fu lady with missiles? yesplz

But for real, that's a fantastic idea. Her pallete swaps would have to get really creative, otherwise we'd end up with Kingdom Hearts levels of darkness.
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Jun 19, 2016 12:37 am

Blonde Mac (Super Punch Out!!!) with ssb4 moveset or vice versa

Dark Bowser (Mario & Luigi: Bowser Inside Story) is a popular character and has potential to be a unique character using various things from his battle
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Jun 19, 2016 1:30 am

Uh...Metal Sonic does have a discussion thread.
I know that because I made that discussion thread.
http://projectcrusade.forumotion.com/t4720-metal-sonic-sonic-cd-discussion-under-construction
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Jun 19, 2016 9:08 am

TrinitroMan wrote:
Uh...Metal Sonic does have a discussion thread.
I know that because I made that discussion thread.
http://projectcrusade.forumotion.com/t4720-metal-sonic-sonic-cd-discussion-under-construction
Too obbessed with getting more supports to notice that this thread was last updated in February
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Sun Jun 19, 2016 9:49 am

What does that have to do with anything.

Why do you feel the need to shittalk every single thing I'm doing? Please stop!
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PostSubject: Re: Dream/Wishlist Character Alts Discussion   Today at 10:21 am

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