Balancing final smashes

just discuss something.

Sucks that balancers don't care about Final Smashes. I hope this gets plenty of traffic.

I suppose this is important. Of course, if we wanted, some of these characters could use new Final Smashes (for example, Peach would probably be better off having a Final Smash that uses her emotions from Super Princess Peach).

These tiers surprise me a little. Crash! and Chaos Inferno are practically the same thing, but they're on almost the opposite sides of the list.

I think Crash! hits instantly, whereas Chaos Inferno gives a gap where you can cancel it out with a final smash or even just a roll/spot dodge.

Your right alot of this stuff doesnt make since
Im Loling now at the broken tiers

Since kirby's is really easy to dodge and so is sonic compare to like

Toon Link I would say a more of a average but right now it has a glitch where it acts like 4 links are coming on both sides. so it has a Invisible range

Knuckles is really easy to dodge and very telegraphic Dont think its high tier worthy

Super Yoshi Tier is pretty lol to

IM REALLY LAUGHING at bomberman = high tier
WE HAVE OUR OWN JOKE when we play if you get hit by bomberman's FS you should stop playing the game rofl

Volt tackle is pretty lol More of a average IMO

Rayman's FS should be LOL Tier i mean you can fkn block it with your shield and its already weak as hell Rayman FS should be redone to something completely different. I think who ever made rayman never played Rayman 2 should have Rayman go Golden Fist


So the main issue here is this list must be based on if you were using Melee Dodge
Since Brawl Dodging is much better for dodging itself on this game since the Melee Dodge on here is not all that perfect. Using Brawl Dodge on FS on this game they are really easy to dodge

Lets not forget NULLING FS with a FS

the placement of Peach's FS is very surprising for me. I find the move to stand out the most and extremely effective

Smash King wrote:

the placement of Peach's FS is very surprising for me. I find the move to stand out the most and extremely effective

^ yea that is definitely not low tier

Eh, it's not like I'm a final smash expert. Although this is good guys, keep up the feedback. If anyone can tell me where final smashes should be on that tier list, feel free to.

I had a few Different Peach Final Smash ideas, that could be more powerful.

My first Final Smash idea is The Psyche Bomb! Based off of the attack of the same name from Super Mario RPG : Legend of the Seven Stars, she releases a stunning red mist from her hands with large range, and then summons Magic Bombs to fall all over the area where the victims are. Deals massive damage and knockback.

My second Final Smash idea is Empress Peach. Based off of the Mega Strike of the same name from Mario Strikers Charged, Peach raises both her arms into crucifix position and grows giant wings. She then dashes forward and kicks the first person she touches, dealing Triforce Slash knockback and damage.

Opinions?

Well it would be cool to make her a new smash rather than taking from brrawl but Its pretty powerful lol.

Well I say you would need two seperate Tier list One for Melee Air Dodge other for Brawl Air Dodge because that makes all the difference in the world. I can see super sonic and bomberman's to be high tier on melee air dodge.

Let's forget about the tier list atm and focus on the matter at hand. Which final smashes should we buff, which ones should we nerf?

Blitz n' Barrage wrote:

I had a few Different Peach Final Smash ideas, that could be more powerful.

My first Final Smash idea is The Psyche Bomb! Based off of the attack of the same name from Super Mario RPG : Legend of the Seven Stars, she releases a stunning red mist from her hands with large range, and then summons Magic Bombs to fall all over the area where the victims are. Deals massive damage and knockback.

This would be very nice.

I actually did plan on looking into these and reviving the thread, but right now we have BR stuff to worry about, followed by character balance. This stuff is on the lowest priority right now but the BB can get it done by v0.9 no problem, and thats when the the changes would happen anyway.

That's nice to hear. Even though it's low priority, I'm glad to hear these will be looked into before 0.9 arrives.

Raymans and bomberman's FS should go into a new tier

"I should quit the game forever if I was KO'd to this Tier"

Eh, I should have done some suggestions earlier. But oh well. After using FS for a while, here are some changes that should be done. I might shoot some more later, but we see. IMO every Final Smash should have the potential for triple KO.

Ridley

-Getting hit at the start-up attack in the air should freeze the enemy in the air long enough to get hit by Ridley. Because right now, using it in air is useless. It will surely miss when the enemy just fall downwards when being hit by the startup attack.
-Increase the range of start-up attack a bit, also for the finishing move.

Lucario

-Getting hit by the first two punches in the combo should trap the enemy instead of letting it stay limited to the third hit.
-Close Combat should trap multiple enemies as well if they come in contact with the third hit.

Ness

-Give it the ability to trap multiple enemies.
-The start-up attack should have more range in order to give it a slightest chance to hit multiple enemies at once.

Goku

-Let it trap multiple enemies at once.
-The first hit should get sligthly increased range.

Goku(Kaio-Ken)

-Increase duration and hitbox size(Might change method for buffing)
-Shouldn't enter helpless state after the move is finished.

Link

-Increased Range.
-Should trap multiple enemies.

Meta Knight

-Increase the range of the cape.

Lucas

-Make the hitbox smaller for the meteorites.
-Zoom out the camera when he activates the FS if possible.

Meta Knight

-Increase the range of the cape (Suggested by MP3 toaster)

BomberMan

-Needs a new final smash

Suggestion: Power Bomb. Lifts up a power bomb and can toss it anywhere on the field. When on contact with floor or enemy, bursts into a huge explosion. BomberMan can get damaged by his own final smash (To represent his origins).

Waluigi

-Needs a new final smash

Suggestion: DDR Apocalypse. Waluigi will begin dancing as four arrows from above (representing the four DDR arrows) will appear on the top of the screen. Pressing arrow keys will drop heavy damaging bombs. They cannot be constantly spammed as there is a 3 bomb limit within the field. When a bomb explodes, you can summon another one. This happens within a limited time

Kirby

Suggestion: Instead of Crash, we could have Mic. For up to 3 times, if he presses B: He would send out a damaging shockwave surrounding him. Also, once started, the time is limited so he can't hold it up forever to his advantage. Also, every time he does Mic: he changes outfits for each Mic attack like in his kirby games

You have all the right to disagree on this if you'd like but just some final smash ideas i thought could be more unique than their original counterparts

Ridley's needs to be in Lol tier i mean its blockable with shield

Enough with the tier list, just talk about balancing the final smashes. I'll post something later if I come up with something. I like all suggestions so far, although I'm not sure what it will be like to program Lucas' camera thing.

Maikeru wrote:

Suggestion: Instead of Crash, we could have Mic. For up to 3 times, if he presses B: He would send out a damaging shockwave surrounding him. Also, once started, the time is limited so he can't hold it up forever to his advantage. Also, every time he does Mic: he changes outfits for each Mic attack like in his kirby games

You have all the right to disagree on this if you'd like but just some final smash ideas i thought could be more unique than their original counterparts

I like this idea.

Some of the final smashes could be redone. But alot of them are ok, it seems that adding characters is more important atm than final smashes.

PikachuPowerIsEpic wrote:

Some of the final smashes could be redone. But a lot of them are ok, it seems that adding characters is more important atm than final smashes.

This is an improvement on characters' final smashes. Also, the improvement on characters' final smashes will be a great idea for future updates.

1. Mach Rider's final smash will start off by riding a motorcycle and running over 1 or more characters. Upon getting caught, the cinematic final smash will involve 1 or more characters ending up on the road. Then, Mach Rider rides his motorcycle and fires a barrage of bullets towards the opponents and it ends the cinematic final smash by running them over.

2. Yoshi's final smash is called Yoshi Stampede, which he dashes at 1 or more opponents. Upon getting caught for a cinematic final smash, they fall to the ground only for a herd of Yoshis to trample on the opponents.

3. Gooey will have a cinematic final smash of Dark Matter, which starts off by dashing at 1 or more opponents. Upon getting caught, they end up in the sky. Gooey is in his Dark Matter form and shoots a barrage of fireballs at 1 or more opponents.

4. Luigi's final smash is called Poltergust G-00. He takes out his poltergust; furthermore, anyone close to Luigi will get sucked inside the poltergust and will be shot out flying.

5. Donkey Kong will have a cinematic final smash version of Rambi ride. Donkey Kong will punch 1 or more opponents. Upon getting caught, the cinematic final smash will start with 1 or more opponents ending up in the jungle. Then, Donkey Kong is riding on Rambi as it charges at the opponents and running over them.

6. Crash Bandicoot's final smash is called Boulder Dash. Crash starts by spinning and charging towards 1 or more opponents. After getting caught, 1 or more opponents fall on the ground. Crash runs past the opponents and a boulder crushes them.

7. Fox McCloud's cinematic final starts when he rushes towards 1 or more opponents. Then in the cinematic final smash, the opponents end up on a different field, and Fox yells "Landmaster!" The Landmaster tank goes down and ends the cinematic final smash by shooting a laser at the opponents.

8. Falco Lombardi's final smash is called Team Star Fox. Basically, he activates a reticle and the arwings swoop passed the opponents. Upon getting caught for the cinematic final smash, 3 arwings including Falco will shoot a barrage of lasers at the opponents.

9. Shantae's/Nega Shantae's final smash is called Mermaid Bubble. She transforms into a mermaid, leaps upward being protected by an invincibility bubble, and shoots arcs of exploding bubbles everywhere.

10. Ashley's cinematic final smash starts off by sucking the opponents inside a pot. Then a cutscene shows Ashley bursting magic energy and letting the monster plant eat the opponents, which instantly KOs them.

11. Tails' cinematic final smash starts off by letting the plane running over opponents. Upon getting caught, in the cinematic final smash like Falco's, Tails will fly in the sky launching a tornado at the opponents.

12. Petey Piranha will turn giant holding 2 cages jumping around and capturing opponents. He breathes fire on each cage and smashes them on the ground sending the opponents flying.

13. Porky's final smash starts off by shooting a quick laser. Anyone who gets caught will be in a cinematic final smash, it starts off with an army of pigmasks firing beams and throwing time bombs at the opponents. The cinematic final smash ends with the King Statue appearing and giving one fatal stomp at the opponents.

14. Snake's final smash is called Covering Fire. Basically, he tosses a flare grenade and a reticle will appear on the screen; therefore, guide the reticle to lock on to opponents. Afterward, a barrage of missiles flies in hitting opponents.

15. Saki Amamiya slices 1 or more opponents with her Dolphin Gun. Anyone who gets caught will be in a cinematic final smash, which involves 1 or more opponents ending up in a sandy area. Saki goes in his Ruffian transformation, locks on at the opponents, and shoots a barrage of lasers at them.

16. Mr. Game and Watch's final smash is of course the Octopus. It will no longer control the Octopus but will control vertically; furthermore, it will charge towards and abduct the opponents and will be dragged off the arena.

17. Goku's final smash is called Dragon Fist. He turns Super Saiyan 3 and rushes towards 1 opponent. The cinematic final smash by punching the opponent in the sky. Then, he yells, "If I don't who will?!" Goku does an uppercut and yells, "Dragon Fist!" It unleashes a golden dragon and charges towards the opponent.

18. Bomberman throws a powerbomb on 1 or more opponents. Anyone caught by the explosion will start the cinematic final smash, the opponents end up on an island, and Bomberman flies on his plane and drops a dangerous bomb on the opponents making an explosion with an instant KO.

19. For Wario's final smash, Wario becomes Wario Man and charges at the opponents. A cinematic final smash starts with Wario beating the opponents up and ending with a fart.

20. Ristar's final smash is called Greeedy's Demise. Basically, Ristar charges an opponent. A person caught will be in a cinematic final smash, which starts with the opponent inside Castle Greedy. The alarm sounded, the entire castle explodes, and Ristar flies away.

21. Bowser's final smash is called Giant Bowser Punch. Bowser will appear in the stage background giant. Upon guiding the reticle and targeting the opponent, Bowser will deliver a powerful punch against the opponent.

22. Duck Hunt's final smash is called NES Zapper Posse. It starts off with the dog sending an army of ducks against the opponent. Anyone caught will be in a cinematic final smash, which consists of wild gunmen, gangster, lady, and policeman shooting a barrage of bullets at the opponents.

23. Pikachu's final smash is called Volt Tackle.

24. Sonic's final smash called Super Sonic will have no control; therefore, he flies automatically by flying across the screen.

25. ROB's final smash is called Guided Robo Beam. ROB shoots a green laser from his eyes and ends it with one final blast at the opponents.

26. Ice Climber's final smash is called Ice Berg, in which a spinning Ice Berg appears and controlling left and right damaging opponents.

27. For Rayman's final smash. I understand his final smash is Moskito. Rayman activates his final smash by shooting a magical fist at 1 or more opponents. Anyone caught will start the cinematic final smash. Rayman flies on Moskito and shoots a barrage of projectiles at the opponents.

28. Mega Man's final smash could be Mega Man Legends.

29. Pac-Man's final smash can be improved by automatically moving around the screen but can be controlled up and down.