Ganondorf Discussion

Discuss, share opinions, ideas, etc. about Ganondorf.

I have a question, what's the big difference about Up Air and Neutral Air? They both look the same and I think they have the same range. Haven't tested them properly yet...

Up air is upward and neutral air is forward. Up air is also slower and stronger, while neutral air stays out much longer with a low hitbox that lasts at the end. Up air is meant for heavy hits towards the upper blastline, neutral air is meant as a forward spacing/pushing tool. Their animations are also hugely different so i dont see where the confusion is coming from.

Honestly I thought they looked pretty similar the first time I used him too...

Same here

Well, Ganon flips in the uair, and doesn't in the nair. But it's pretty hard to notice while the big freaking sword is up there.

I'm sure we could reverse uair's animation without any bad effects, so at least the swing is in the opposite direction.

Who has two thumbs and ideas for this character's Final Smash Moveset?!

Final Smashes

Burning Smash: Ganon of Time

Blazing Smash: Ganon of Twilight

Final Smash: The Spirit of Demise

Question; what exactly does his D-Spec *do*, and is it *supposed* to delay/spam if you hold down D-Spec?

I think it's kind of like FLUDD in that it pushes opponents away (see also Ridley's Side Special). I usually don't use it unless I'm trying to push the other player away while he's recovering. It's very easy to punish on-stage.

Falcon8r wrote:

I think it's kind of like FLUDD in that it pushes opponents away (see also Ridley's Side Special). I usually don't use it unless I'm trying to push the other player away while he's recovering. It's very easy to punish on-stage.

I thought so, too, but it seems pretty ineffective at that job... They windbox isn't really all that powerful. : /

Right, IMO it's like a worse version of Ridley's Side Special. At least it has more range than Ridley's but meh, most of the times I could use it I just use Ganon's fireball instead.

Falcon8r wrote:

Right, IMO it's like a worse version of Ridley's Side Special. At least it has more range than Ridley's but meh, most of the times I could use it I just use Ganon's fireball instead.

Exactly... Perhaps if it deals slash damage without any knockback, like a rapid version of Fox's N-Spec, it could be given more use? '_'

The advantage over Ridley's side special is that it can be held indefinitely, and it's a projectile. The range is HUGE. You should ideally use it while the opponent is still relatively far from the stage, just close enough for it to hit.

Dry wrote:

The advantage over Ridley's side special is that it can be held indefinitely, and it's a projectile. The range is HUGE. You should ideally use it while the opponent is still relatively far from the stage, just close enough for it to hit.

Hrm... Could the windbox be *ever-so-slightly* buffed then, please? Because at least Ridley's S-Spec has a hitbox to go with it. ^_-'"

I guess it could. It's been receiving buffs in stages, and I thought that by now it would be strong enough.

Could also be strong enough anyway. Not accusing anyone of anything, but how are you guys testing it? Keep in mind that windboxes are much stronger against characters in the air, which is what this move is used for. If you're testing against characters on the ground, they should barely budge. Just checking that there isn't a misunderstanding here.

It's definitely ok in terms of pushing enemies away from the edge. I think we need to experiment more though. It's just terrible on stage though, which I think makes it unattractive in general.

It gets a much bigger push on releasing B.
That repeated sound effect has got to go, it's so irritating.
And i think wind mechanics as a whole should get a bit of a buff against on stage characters.
Damaging hitboxes that inflict no stun would be cool, with a hitbox right in front of him somewhere sensible that actually does knock away. Even given the moves uses, i agree that overall it's unattractive and certainly seems useless at first.

Dry wrote:

I guess it could. It's been receiving buffs in stages, and I thought that by now it would be strong enough.

Could also be strong enough anyway. Not accusing anyone of anything, but how are you guys testing it? Keep in mind that windboxes are much stronger against characters in the air, which is what this move is used for. If you're testing against characters on the ground, they should barely budge. Just checking that there isn't a misunderstanding here.

I'm using it against both, and honestly it's overshadowed by his N-Spec except for in *very* situational moments (like when someone recovers slightly over the edge and you have enough time to spam it). As for spamming it, I'm holding it down; It's... Honestly not as effective either way to push people away.

That being said, is it possible to make it stronger solely on the ground? I feel like it'd be cool as a fixed-knockback, 0% damage move that launches opponents enough to move them back a good distance but not enough to kill them, at least just on the ground; I'm thinking of something similar to the piano scene from OoT, which is where I assume the team got the inspiration for the move.

Yeah, it looks like that was the inspiration. And our version does nothing similar to it.
I'll toy around with the move.

Perfect Hell wrote:

Yeah, it looks like that was the inspiration.  And our version does nothing similar to it.
I'll toy around with the move.

Thank you! To be honest, this is the only relevant Smash fangame after SSB4 mainly because of just how flexible you guys are; Thanks for that. ^-^

Ok, my opinion of Ganon change's we need based on OoT:
- Float (i thought P:M decision was weird here, but now that i've gone back i remember how central it actually is to his character in a fight)
- Neutral B should stun
- Neutral B should be able to be reflected by any disjointed attack
- Ganon could gain the volley attack from P:M on neutral B while a projectile is already out. This would grant him invincibility, giving him a safe way to volley his reflected projectiles back again
- Down B should not have a wind effect at all, instead it should deal constant small hits with high SDI so you can get out of it by holding away from him or towards him until you are pushed out. The last hit could get increased knockback

Perfect Hell wrote:

Ok, my opinion of Ganon change's we need based on OoT:
- Float (i thought P:M decision was weird here, but now that i've gone back i remember how central it actually is to his character in a fight)
- Neutral B should stun
- Neutral B should be able to be reflected by any disjointed attack
- Ganon could gain the volley attack from P:M on neutral B while a projectile is already out.  This would grant him invincibility, giving him a safe way to volley his reflected projectiles back again
- Down B should not have a wind effect at all, instead it should deal constant small hits with high SDI so you can get out of it by holding away from him or towards him until you are pushed out.  The last hit could get increased knockback

...I like *all* of these. If you could do *any* of these, I would never stop playing Crusade ever. .-.

I suggest flat-out redoing the Big G as his Project Melee counterpart.

Spoon300 wrote:

I suggest flat-out redoing the Big G as his Project Melee counterpart.

That is the exact opposite of a decloning. >_>'"

No thanks.

Spoon300 wrote:

I suggest flat-out redoing the Big G as his Project Melee counterpart.

Ganon's Project M moveset is trash in my opinion.

C_Mill24 wrote:

Spoon300 wrote:

I suggest flat-out redoing the Big G as his Project Melee counterpart.

Ganon's Project M moveset is trash in my opinion.

He flies, he reflects, and he looks *just* like Captain Falcon.

...Nnnnope. Please do not do that. >_>'"

I'm in favor of keeping the current moveset and making his Neutral B easily reflectable by other moves and giving him the ability to also reflect it.

Also, why not make his neutral B projectile look more like the OOT one? I.e. as glowing yellow ball of light that has electrical effects on hit?

Falcon8r wrote:

I'm in favor of keeping the current moveset and making his Neutral B easily reflectable by other moves and giving him the ability to also reflect it.

Also, why not make his neutral B projectile look more like the OOT one? I.e. as glowing yellow ball of light that has electrical effects on hit?

Eh, I understand that, but I kind of like the way it looks as is. ^_^

Plus, its asymmetrical shape would make it easier to see when it's reflected.

Not to mention the fact that it's moving pretty fast in the opposite direction. >_>

I like the new look too, but honestly it would feel more like Ganondorf if it resembled the OOT projectile, just my opinion.

Hey, even in Twilight Princess he has the same type of projectile.