Super Smash Bros Wii U/3DS Discussion

Well thay whiteboard drawing is from around last year iirc...

Dr.CanadianBacon wrote:

Well thay whiteboard drawing is from around last year iirc...

Yeah, it's very old, but I though something new had been discovered by wording on the post.

BTW the code on the post is broken, here's the image.

I dont see anything new

I mean, look at the characters.

Save from Bowser, and if we count Zamus as Samus, EVERY veteran character revealed as of now are on that board. That include Luigi, Pit and Olimar (There is a Pikmin), and that also applies for Yoshi, which is neither revealed as a playable and on that board.

Let's face it, it's either an incredible coincidence, or an approximation of the roster.

Well, there's 8 confirmed to 5 unconfirmed veterans there (Not counting Olimar and counting ZSS as unconfirmed), that's not really saying anything IMO.

Unless you mean that these are the next five veterans, which I highly doubt because Mr.G&W is well known as an unlockable, it wouldn't make sense for him to be a starter.

If C. Falcon is still in, I'm happy.

Furry Heihachi wrote:

Well, there's 8 confirmed to 5 unconfirmed veterans there (Not counting Olimar and counting ZSS as unconfirmed), that's not really saying anything IMO.

Unless you mean that these are the next five veterans, which I highly doubt because Mr.G&W is well known as an unlockable, it wouldn't make sense for him to be a starter.

I mean, out of the 11 veterans confirmed, 10 are on that board. And important ones that are still not confirmed are not on that said board. I kinda see a trend there.

Kiddragon wrote:

Furry Heihachi wrote:

Well, there's 8 confirmed to 5 unconfirmed veterans there (Not counting Olimar and counting ZSS as unconfirmed), that's not really saying anything IMO.

Unless you mean that these are the next five veterans, which I highly doubt because Mr.G&W is well known as an unlockable, it wouldn't make sense for him to be a starter.

I mean, out of the 11 veterans confirmed, 10 are on that board. And important ones that are still not confirmed are not on that said board. I kinda see a trend there.

Technically 11 out of 11, considering that the Blue Pikmin is a returning vet and basically represents Olimar.

AEM wrote:

Kiddragon wrote:

Furry Heihachi wrote:

Well, there's 8 confirmed to 5 unconfirmed veterans there (Not counting Olimar and counting ZSS as unconfirmed), that's not really saying anything IMO.

Unless you mean that these are the next five veterans, which I highly doubt because Mr.G&W is well known as an unlockable, it wouldn't make sense for him to be a starter.

I mean, out of the 11 veterans confirmed, 10 are on that board. And important ones that are still not confirmed are not on that said board. I kinda see a trend there.

Technically 11 out of 11, considering that the Blue Pikmin is a returning vet and basically represents Olimar.

Bowser is not. But still.

Kiddragon wrote:

AEM wrote:

Kiddragon wrote:

Furry Heihachi wrote:

Well, there's 8 confirmed to 5 unconfirmed veterans there (Not counting Olimar and counting ZSS as unconfirmed), that's not really saying anything IMO.

Unless you mean that these are the next five veterans, which I highly doubt because Mr.G&W is well known as an unlockable, it wouldn't make sense for him to be a starter.

I mean, out of the 11 veterans confirmed, 10 are on that board. And important ones that are still not confirmed are not on that said board. I kinda see a trend there.

Technically 11 out of 11, considering that the Blue Pikmin is a returning vet and basically represents Olimar.

Bowser is not. But still.

oh derp i forgot bowser
Also Smashking, you have yet to add the Pilotwings Stage to the OP.
EDIT: Might as well post these here too

Starter Roster:

Final Roster:

The characters on the bottom are transformable characters.
Feel free to tell me what you think of it.

Added Pilotwing stage.

I know there was more stuff confirmed that I forgot to add, but I'm having trouble keeping track of this thread as well as Crusade & real life stuff

So today's pic of the day...

I think it's safe to assume that the 3DS Kid Icarus stage probably isn't related to Gaol's castle at all. It's just some ruins away from the town in Chapter 11.

I doubt it.

I think the stage starts off as Gaol's Castle, then the Reset Bomb is launched by that Viridi character, which then changes the layout once your inside.

Gaol's Castle wasn't near any towns though.

AEM wrote:

EDIT: Might as well post these here too

Starter Roster:

Final Roster:

The characters on the bottom are transformable characters.
Feel free to tell me what you think of it.

Well Toon Link is very, very unlikely to return thanks to the Spirit Tracks stage, I think your list is pretty good though I think Ike will be gone for Chrom, and I think Lucario will be gone for a new Gen Pokémon.

But Sakurai said himself that so far no characters are cut. So, Toon Link still has a chance to be playable, unfortunately for me.

And besides, characters that don't return can always be added back in as DLC.

Furry Heihachi wrote:

AEM wrote:

EDIT: Might as well post these here too

Starter Roster:

Final Roster:

The characters on the bottom are transformable characters.
Feel free to tell me what you think of it.

Well Toon Link is very, very unlikely to return thanks to the Spirit Tracks stage, I think your list is pretty good though I think Ike will be gone for Chrom, and I think Lucario will be gone for a new Gen Pokémon.

- Sakurai has previously stated that having two Links is important. Toon Link was the most requested Zelda character for Brawl in Japan. So, I personally think he's a safe bet. After all Spirit Tracks and Windwaker are roughly a century years apart and there have never been any problems with having more than two links on screen at once (Toon Link and Link, alternate colors) so I'm not sure what the problem would be here.
- Ike is one of the most popular Fire Emblem lords, I don't think we'll be seeing him gone, even for Chrom.
- Mewtwo wasn't very prominent in advertisement during Brawl's development, but Lucario's was. Which is why Lucario got priority over Mewtwo in the end. This time however, Lucario is still prominent in advertisement these days and is still a very popular Pokemon. Not to mention that his relevancy is still in tip top form due to the Mega Evolutions. No NextGen Pokemon really tops Lucario other than arguably Zoroark and Genesect, but neither of those two rival Lucario in popularity.
- Sakurai has previously mentioned his disgust towards cuts, so I'm thinking he's going to avoid cuts like the plague.

AEM wrote:

Furry Heihachi wrote:

AEM wrote:

EDIT: Might as well post these here too

Starter Roster:

Final Roster:

The characters on the bottom are transformable characters.
Feel free to tell me what you think of it.

Well Toon Link is very, very unlikely to return thanks to the Spirit Tracks stage, I think your list is pretty good though I think Ike will be gone for Chrom, and I think Lucario will be gone for a new Gen Pokémon.

- Sakurai has previously stated that having two Links is important. Toon Link was the most requested Zelda character for Brawl in Japan. So, I personally think he's a safe bet. After all Spirit Tracks and Windwaker are roughly a century years apart and there have never been any problems with having more than two links on screen at once (Toon Link and Link, alternate colors) so I'm not sure what the problem would be here.
- Ike is one of the most popular Fire Emblem lords, I don't think we'll be seeing him gone, even for Chrom.
- Mewtwo wasn't very prominent in advertisement during Brawl's development, but Lucario's was. Which is why Lucario got priority over Mewtwo in the end. This time however, Lucario is still prominent in advertisement these days and is still a very popular Pokemon. Not to mention that his relevancy is still in tip top form due to the Mega Evolutions. No NextGen Pokemon really tops Lucario other than arguably Zoroark and Genesect, but neither of those two rival Lucario in popularity.
- Sakurai has previously mentioned his disgust towards cuts, so I'm thinking he's going to avoid cuts like the plague.

This is probably untrue but I heard that Chrom is actually pretty disliked as a protagonist so I don't think he'll be making it in.

LeeYawshee wrote:

AEM wrote:

Furry Heihachi wrote:

AEM wrote:

EDIT: Might as well post these here too

Starter Roster:

Final Roster:

The characters on the bottom are transformable characters.
Feel free to tell me what you think of it.

Well Toon Link is very, very unlikely to return thanks to the Spirit Tracks stage, I think your list is pretty good though I think Ike will be gone for Chrom, and I think Lucario will be gone for a new Gen Pokémon.

- Sakurai has previously stated that having two Links is important. Toon Link was the most requested Zelda character for Brawl in Japan. So, I personally think he's a safe bet. After all Spirit Tracks and Windwaker are roughly a century years apart and there have never been any problems with having more than two links on screen at once (Toon Link and Link, alternate colors) so I'm not sure what the problem would be here.
- Ike is one of the most popular Fire Emblem lords, I don't think we'll be seeing him gone, even for Chrom.
- Mewtwo wasn't very prominent in advertisement during Brawl's development, but Lucario's was. Which is why Lucario got priority over Mewtwo in the end. This time however, Lucario is still prominent in advertisement these days and is still a very popular Pokemon. Not to mention that his relevancy is still in tip top form due to the Mega Evolutions. No NextGen Pokemon really tops Lucario other than arguably Zoroark and Genesect, but neither of those two rival Lucario in popularity.
- Sakurai has previously mentioned his disgust towards cuts, so I'm thinking he's going to avoid cuts like the plague.

This is probably untrue but I heard that Chrom is actually pretty disliked as a protagonist so I don't think he'll be making it in.

It's not just that either.
Sakurai said that he's looking for characters that bring something new to the table. So what does another blue-haired Falchion user bring new for the Smash? Nothing really.

EDIT:
Pic of the daaaay~

Pilotwings / Wuhu Island is looking like it's going to be the Halberd of Smash U.

Time to bring in my two cents now that I can finally post again.

-In relation to Toon Link, the Spirit Tracks stage, and Sakurai's comment:
Sakurai only said that no character had to have been cut so far during development. This DOES NOT directly mean that no one from Brawl isn't going to be in this game. Just that no character that has been planned for this game had to be have been removed from the roster at the time he said it.

So really, we don't know if Toon Link is like Mewtwo, who was planned for Brawl, or like Pichu, who wasn't.
If Toon Link is like Mewtwo, then he hasn't been removed from the line-up yet (again, at the time of the statement). If Toon Link is like Pichu, then he wasn't even on the line-up to begin with.

Given that:
a. Toon Link was a low-priority character in Brawl.
b. Toon Link is a clone/semi-clone (And is the closest of Brawl's characters to be in full clone territory)
c. Toon Link is an alternate version of an existing character. (Don't pull the "different Link" argument; I've discovered that Smash uses one universal "Link", and Toon Link is treated as just another version not unlike Dr. Mario is to Mario).
d. Toon Link directly appears on the Spirit Tracks stage (Again, remember that the "different Link" argument does not apply to Smash).


It wouldn't surprise me if Toon Link wasn't even considered to return.
That being said, there is no way to tell what's going to happen with Toon Link at this point in time. However, I'm skeptical on his return.


-In relation to "relevancy cuts" about Ike and Lucario:
I'm just going to say that it's bullshit aside for Pokémon, but that's a whole other can of worms.
Ike being "replaced" by Chrom is rather laughable considering that the only logic to go by this is the "Ike replaced Roy" nonsense.
Ike did not replace Roy. Roy would not have data if he did, much like how Young Link has no data while Toon Link does. While yes, Sakurai wanted a "more recent" Fire Emblem character, that does not mean he wanted the "most recent".
More recent meant anyone that came after Roy's game. And at the time that characters were being decided, there were three games to choose from, Blazing Sword (known simply as "Fire Emblem" outside Japan), The Sacred Stones, and Path of Radiance.
Of those three games' main characters (Eliwood, Eirika, and Ike), Ike stood out the most not in just concept (he had a very heavy sword that he was swinging around with ease and even had a (formerly) unique skill in Aether), but in popularity. Even if Intelligent Systems hadn't suggested Ike, Sakurai would have probably gone with him since he jumped at the chance to have Ike with a fighting style that heavily contrasted Marth.

As for the future, Ike was not a clone like Roy was, nor was he a late afterthought addition like Roy (and the other Melee clones). Not only that, but he continues to give influence to the series much like Marth did after he was no longer "relevant". Granted the only non-remake title since Ike's games was Awakening, however, Chrom's design was influenced by Ike's (especially evident with concept art showing Chrom having a color scheme just like Ike's and in a pose where he rests his sword on his shoulders like Ike does), and Ike's legend lives on through the existence of Paris in the game, being Ike's descendant and wielding Ragnell. With that in mind, there's less of a reason to believe Ike will be cut or even low-priority like Roy was.

As for Pokémon, I did say it was a separate can of worms. This is because Sakurai actually mentioned how Pokémon characters are chosen for the most part, something that previously went without mention. Relevancy is clearly involved within it, however, it isn't the end-all decision.
Relevancy refers NOT to whatever Generation is newest, but by which Pokémon are frequent in promotion, as well as who's starring in recent movies and some influences from the anime itself.
This is why Mewtwo and Jigglypuff were low priority in Brawl; they were not marketed much during Brawl's character decision time. It certainly wasn't because they were "irrelevant" by Generation standards, because FireRed and LeafGreen were still somewhat fresh (with Emerald being the latest game at the time of character decision) and Pokémon Trainer and his set were JUST AS IRRELEVANT Generation-wise.
Lucario? His movie was in the works when Sakurai was picking characters. In fact, the movie came out just a few days after the roster for Brawl was "finalized" on July 7, 2005.

However, like I said, it isn't the end-all deal. What IS the end-all decision according to Sakurai is this: what is unique about them and where they fit with the rest of the game.
If Lucario hadn't been a viable option for Smash, he would not have been included, and instead, we would have got someone like Deoxys unless he didn't see Deoxys working. This is why Mewtwo was playable in Melee and not Lugia, Entei, or Celebi, who all had movies since Mewtwo between Smash 64 and Melee (though Mewtwo Returns may have had a role to play as well).

Now, let's think about the present for a bit.
We've recently had a movie that stars Mewtwo (albeit a different one from before as well as the species' newly introduced Mega Evolution) with a set of Genesect co-stars.
So Mewtwo is very likely to return to Smash in the next game (it also helps that he is one of the most requested characters), and Genesect is a possibility if Sakurai sees it fit to be a playable character.

None of the 6th Generation Pokémon have been heavily promoted enough to be considered at this point with the exception of Sylveon (who was the star of the Pikachu short prior to the Mewtwo/Genesect movie), Helioptile, Gogoat, and Noivern (who are all shown in the anime under the ownership of Alexa from X/Y, who is currently traveling with Ash and friends), none of which particularly scream of potential Smash newcomer.
And no, there is no "secret special Pokémon Sakurai knows about" that will be included; Sakurai already stated that not much market research has been done for X/Y since the games are not out, and by now, the roster is very likely to have been "finalized".

This is of course not factoring in something like Mega Mewtwo, as it's not really a new Pokémon from the 6th Generation, though it IS prominently promoted alongside other Mega Evolved Pokémon (which includes LUCARIO), and it is a part of the recent movie.
However, since Mega Mewtwo is well...Mewtwo, it would be part of a returning Mewtwo and not in place of it.

Speaking of Lucario, it's been getting a lot of promotion even after the 4th Generation, including a Mega Evolution as stated before, so it doesn't seem that likely that Lucario will be cut given the circumstances on why Mewtwo was.


-In relation to Chrom and "what he brings to the table":
As much as I'd rather have a Karas-inspired Lucina, I'm going to have to defend Chrom on this point.
At first glance all you would see is a blue haired swordsman with nothing interesting to work with.

However, bear in mind that Chrom is capable of using Lances once he promotes to Great Lord, giving him a projectile option in the form of the Javelin.
There is also the Class Changing system which opens Chrom to more weapon options such as Axes, Bows, and Tomes as well as the Skills available to those classes.

While yes, using certain weapons without being in certain classes is not possible for Chrom, it's a bit of rule-bending that is on par with a lot of cases in Smash already like Mega Man's ability to use multiple game's worth of Robot Master weapons on the fly or Ness'/Lucas' ability to use PK powers they never even learn in their games.






....woooooo.
That took quite a bit of time to type....

Write a book about it, nerd.

white person wrote:

Write a book about it, nerd.

I kind of thing you have crossed the line, bro.

Slissith wrote:

white person wrote:

Write a book about it, nerd.

I kind of thing you have crossed the line, bro.

I crossed the line a long time ago and I never went back.

white person wrote:

Slissith wrote:

white person wrote:

Write a book about it, nerd.

I kind of thing you have crossed the line, bro.

I crossed the line a long time ago and I never went back.

Well, maybe it's time to reconsider. I view you as an occasional voice of truth in the community and I am epecially fond of you, but just trying to offend someone for the sake of offending him is too much of a degradation in comparison the bro I remember.

You said you crossed the line a while ago. Very amusing because this is the first time I see such behaviour from you.

You're much better than that.

He's just playing around Sliss we all know that.

Anyway, dayum golden that's a pretty good read XD

Slissith wrote:

white person wrote:

Slissith wrote:

white person wrote:

Write a book about it, nerd.

I kind of thing you have crossed the line, bro.

I crossed the line a long time ago and I never went back.

Well, maybe it's time to reconsider. I view you as an occasional voice of truth in the community and I am epecially fond of you, but just trying to offend someone for the sake of offending him is too much of a degradation in comparison the bro I remember.

You said you crossed the line a while ago. Very amusing because this is the first time I see such behaviour from you.

You're much better than that.

     

If we look at popularity they need to bring Mewtwo back and i want Scizor or maybe Dragonite to be in but its just personal since for The Moment Smash have : Electric ( Pikachu-Pichu ) Water ( Squirtle ) Fire-Flying ( Charizard ) Grass-Poison ( Ivysaur ) Physic ( Mewtwo ) Fighting-Steel ( Lucario ) . Scizor ( Bug-Steel ) and Dragonite ( Dragon-Flying ) are new type that were not in smash and they are popular and also Legendary most of they are too big or Flying to be add in Smash so that it for me .

Lucario # 32 : http://ca.ign.com/top/pokemon/32

Mewtwo # 2 : http://ca.ign.com/top/pokemon/2

Charizard # 1 : http://ca.ign.com/top/pokemon/1

Pikachu # 48 and Jigglypuff is one of the original twelve so yeah ... also Scizor # 19 is one that i can cosider for smash put a Bug type in smash also beacause all the other except Dragonite dont really fit

# 18 Entei : Legendary we already have Mewtwo

# 17 Gengar : Ghost Type its like putting Boo in the game

# 16 Suicuine : Same reason as Entei

# 15 Venusaur : We already have Ivysaur

# 14 Ho-Oh : Flying Fire Type + Legendary

# 13 Articuno : Flying Type + Legendary

# 12 Arcanine : Fire Type we already have Charizard

# 11 Gyarados : Way too big

# 10 Zekrom : too big + Legendary

# 9 Tyranatar : Water Type we already have Squirtle

# 8 Zapdos : Flying Tunder + Legendary

# 7 Rayquaza : Too big and Legendary

# 6 Mew : We already have Mewtwo

# 5 Dragonite : That one could fit if they put a different moveset from Charizard

# 4 Lugia : Flying Legendary

# 3 Blastoise : We already have Squirtle

#1 and # 2 is Charizard and Mewtwo

This pool was made after the release of Black & White 2 ( Im not sure ) they will probably made a newers one after the release of Pokemon X and Y we will just have to wait and see .

Quote :

If we look at popularity they need to bring Mewtwo back and i want Scizor or maybe Dragonite to be in but its just personal since for The Moment Smash have : Electric ( Pikachu-Pichu ) Water ( Squirtle ) Fire-Flying ( Charizard ) Grass-Poison ( Ivysaur ) Physic ( Mewtwo ) Fighting-Steel ( Lucario ) . Scizor ( Bug-Steel ) and Dragonite ( Dragon-Flying ) are new type that were not in smash and they are popular and also Legendary most of they are too big or Flying to be add in Smash so that it for me .

Jigglypuff is now Normal/Fairy, so you can cross those two off too.

I personally don't think Pokemon would be chosen from popularity. I feel like Mewtwo does have a large chance to get back in, but I feel like Sakurai would want to have a representative from 5th/6th gen. They did this with Brawl and added Lucario in but that doesn't mean much still. If we look back at the first game Mewtwo was apparently supposed to be in it, but was cut I think due to time. And I also heard he was going to be in Brawl but cut due to time or something. I feel like Mewtwo has more of a chance than any other Pokemon to get back in, especially with him being able to also represent 6th gen with Mega Mewtwo, but this is just my opinion. I don't think Sakurai would base it off popularity but I may be wrong, but I just don't picture Sakurai searching up "Top ten Pokemon requested for Smash Bros 4".