Golden Sun Characters Poll

So it is really great that Isaac (earth) is being included in the actual game. I am very happy about it that such an underrated game is getting at least a little attention as it has been generally ignored by the mainstream smash series. However, as Golden Sun and its sequel The Lost Age are making their foray into this smash series, I would really like for there to be more representation other than Isaac. He is only one of the four elements that is integral to the games. There are 3 other that are just as cool as earth.

I hope that some get picked to be DLC because they are all fighters!

I guess I will do my sample of a moveset for my personal choice to be selected from this list: Ivan.

Ivan is a Jupiter adept of the Wind. He is a certified bad-donkey.



Ivan uses a rod/wand/scepter to attack. However where is real talent lies in is his Psynergy that is attuned to Jupiter. It includes wind, lightning, and even teleportation (if you have a teleport lapis, lol). Adepts also meet these friendly little critters along the way called Djinn. If they befriend a Djinn, it can aid them in combat!

[img]http://thelostwaters.com/gallery/galleries/goldensun/official/JupiterDjinn.png[/img]

But when you use them in combat they go from set to standby; standby to summon that is!

So With all this in mind i propose Ivan's move set:

Attack combo: rod attacks/smacks/whatever

Neutral special: Whirlwind - Ivan stays in place as a whirlwind circles him left and right.

Side Special: Spark Plasma - Ivan shoots a line of plasma bolts in the direction the psynergy is used


Like this only in a line and not in a circle

Up Special - Using the Teleport Lapis, Ivan teleports in the direction cast (kinda like how Zelda's teleport works, you know you can teleport to the side)

Down Special: Djinn - Randomly uses 1 of 4 Jupiter Djinn.
Djinn #1: Gust - provides a melee range double hit
Djinn #2: Zephyr - Gives Ivan a speed boost in movement, also letting him jump a little higher
Djinn #3: Gale - A wind pushes foes back, doing minor damage.
Djinn #4: Waft - A multi-tiered wind moved outward on all sides of Ivan and has a chance to put them to sleep.

But when Ivan uses a Djinn, It goes from set to standby. Unfortunately, Djinn will not be able to stack on standby like in the actual games. But the mechanic of Djinn will change to summon. It will become

Summon Jupiter: Spirit of the Jupiter Djinn will fly down and unleash a barrage of wind blades. After putting in all the work though, the Djinn will need to go into recovery for a bit. about 10 seconds or so. This way it provides a bit of balance of unleashing a barrage.



Final Smash: Randomly summons one of the 3 stacked Jupiter summons: Atalanta, Procne, or Thor

Grabs: Will be something psynergy related. even using utility psynergy like cyclone or something where he will rise with the foe and then smash them into the ground.

Ivan can also hover like Peach can using the Hover psynergy.


Well that's all i got for now. I hope you all like it and please consider. I will try and find more images/gifs. I can also do one for the other 2 elements as well. yeah. thanks for reading!

Gah. Can a mod add vote cancelling please?

The DLC should either be Alex or Felix. Alex for uniqueness, being a Mercury (water) Adept and having many completely unique abilities too powerful for others to use. He is the main antagonist of the series as a whole. Felix is another Venus Adept like Isaac, and a member of the player party in the first game. The reason to pick Felix however would be his main protagonist role in the third and most recent game.

None

Vote canceling added

Perfecthell4 wrote:

Gah. Can a mod add vote cancelling please?

The DLC should either be Alex or Felix. Alex for uniqueness, being a Mercury (water) Adept and having many completely unique abilities too powerful for others to use. He is the main antagonist of the series as a whole. Felix is another Venus Adept like Isaac, and a member of the player party in the first game. The reason to pick Felix however would be his main protagonist role in the third and most recent game.

well if you have felix then it is basically a clone of Isaac.

Personally i want Ivan Garet and Mia picked up as DLC. That way there is one of each element.

I didn't play Dark Dawn yet because I don't have the system for it.

also what is vote cancelling? does it let you recast your vote?

Vote cancelling is when you remove your vote for whatever reason.

Mr. Mistress wrote:

Vote cancelling is when you remove your vote for whatever reason.

THIS and also to remove in order to switch your vote for a different candidate.

I currently voted for Alex, but at times I keep hopping back to Felix at times. Can't really decide.

A downside of Alex, unless they showed more in the third game, is that we don't really know how he fights. We know he uses only water, but he can't use Djinn. He can't summon. We don't even know the psynergy that he can use.

I am partial to Jupiter adepts. That is why I want Ivan to be selected very much.

I Vote for Alex .

Wait what. We know how Alex fights, and we know his powers. Not to such a full extent as Isaac, but he has been seen performing different abilities and is known for certain signature abilities, especially his warping ability that, unlike traditional teleporting, allows him to stay "invisible" for however long he likes before reappearing.

Another option would be to use Saturos&Menardi, the primary antagonistic duo, and their FS could incorporate Alex. I'd still prefer to just use Alex though.

when has alex been fought in battle? certainly not in Golden Sun or The Lost Age. Is he fought in combat in Dark Dawn?

No, not through gameplay fights. He has been seen doing many different things in outside combat, like cutscenes.

and how is that enough to go off of?

Alex is an obvious choice for me.

KeybladeMaster wrote:

and how is that enough to go off of?

He has his signatures, he also could presumably use any of the Mercury abilities from any game (being the most powerful Mercury Adept by far), and if that doesn't fill out everything, Sakurai a move here and there. He's still main antagonist and also happens to be a really cool and unique character. I'd hope for this guy to make top 16.

^ Classic appearance. In the latest game, he identified himself as Arcanus and took on this appearance:


None of the other characters could really make as good of a rep, except maybe Felix as I've said before. Felix probably has more moveset potential overall, but I'll still take Alex considering his role and the fact that Felix is the same Adept type as Isaac.

I voted for Alex.

how does felix have more justification for a moveset than the other adepts?

KeybladeMaster wrote:

how does felix have more justification for a moveset than the other adepts?

I didn't say that, I said he has more than Alex. How he beats out the other Adepts however is obvious; he plays the main protagonist in one of the games. The other Adepts are all supporting characters with very little importance by comparison.

Quote :

The reason to pick Felix however would be his main protagonist role in the third and most recent game. The other Adepts are all supporting characters with very little importance by comparison.

wut
Felix is the second game's protagonist. The third game's one is Matthew, Isaac's son. Felix is actually disappeared on the third one; even though he helped, he went down in history as a villain due to previous actions IIRC.

And I can accept that with FF, since you have valid arguments about WoL. But don't make other characters seem unimportant in Felix's favor. I just can't and won't consider your opinion in anything about this subject at all if you do that.

They're called Warriors of Vale in the third for a reason. Guess which one?
If you want to pick an unimportant one by that logic, pick Kraden, since he only provides helpful information, nothing else.

Each one of the characters have their own story and importance to the plot, and aren't just supporting roles as you say. Everyone needs mutual help, and that includes the main characters. Otherwise their journey is pretty much impossible to complete.
Even the lighthouses, key points of the 2 GBA games and maybe the DS game, require adepts of their respective elements to go through them story-wise. This is even the main reason Alex, Saturos and Menardi were using Felix in the first place, and were planning to do so with Sheba. Actually, I think they did so too, since just to enter Venus Lighthouse you need Reveal Psynergy (something from a Jupiter Adept) IIRC.

I'd like a different Adept, and not an Unfought one (even if the villain, Alex's case). Alex is cool and has relevance, but that's it. You'd need to borrow common Psynergy from Mercury Adepts just to make a moveset for him, and he would be purely centered on that.

But in the end, that's all opinion-based. So I won't vote for now, since considering the mindset shown above, the other characters won't be receiving much support thanks to Alex, and my vote won't make a difference here for now. :/

switched to Felix.

Now that I think about it. Despite Felix not being as unique as the other choices, I think he has overall importance to the series as a whole.

Not only does he represents Golden Sun as its 2nd main protagonist, but being a villain in the end kind of gives him more credibility. Think about it, we get the 2nd star of the series while having a villain from the series all in 1 character. Felix is obviously the one that will give us that "Win/Win" situation.

I'd vote for Felix if he was actually way different from Isaac's playstyle, because both of them are Venus Adepts and they pretty much have the same abilities. The different ones are provided only by equippable items, and there aren't many.
And if he had Sol Blade's Unleash Megiddo as the FS instead of Judgement...
BTW, he isn't a villain. He was historically considered one because he was helping the actual villains (he was forced to do so though). His credibility is still there, but the other characters offer more unique options, like you pointed.

Ness_64 wrote:

wut
Felix is the second game's protagonist. The third game's one is Matthew, Isaac's son. Felix is actually disappeared on the third one; even though he helped, he went down in history as a villain due to previous actions IIRC.

And I can accept that with FF, since you have valid arguments about WoL. But don't make other characters seem unimportant in Felix's favor. I just can't and won't consider your opinion in anything about this subject at all if you do that.
They are supporting roles. That doesn't mean unimportant, but if you think they are as important as Isaac or Felix you are deluding yourself.

They're called Warriors of Vale in the third for a reason. Guess which one?
If you want to pick an unimportant one by that logic, pick Kraden, since he only provides helpful information, nothing else.

Each one of the characters have their own story and importance to the plot, and aren't just supporting roles as you say. Everyone needs mutual help, and that includes the main characters. Otherwise their journey is pretty much impossible to complete.
Even the lighthouses, key points of the 2 GBA games and maybe the DS game, require adepts of their respective elements to go through them story-wise. This is even the main reason Alex, Saturos and Menardi were using Felix in the first place, and were planning to do so with Sheba. Actually, I think they did so too, since just to enter Venus Lighthouse you need Reveal Psynergy (something from a Jupiter Adept) IIRC.
Not sure you know what a supporting role is. Apparently supporting characters can't be relevant in any way, have any back story, or do anything for the plot whatsoever.

I'd like a different Adept, and not an Unfought one (even if the villain, Alex's case). Alex is cool and has relevance, but that's it. You'd need to borrow common Psynergy from Mercury Adepts just to make a moveset for him, and he would be purely centered on that.
Series antagonist, that's it? I mean seriously. "Ganondorf is the series antagonist, but that's it. Nothing special". And as I've said, he does in fact have his own unique specials he has used in the past, there's no doubt of moveset possibilities. Between his warps (he has been seen using two different warps, one of which is unique in that he can choose how long to remain phased out before reappearing), his special geysers used against the soldiers in his way in the first game, and other unique Mercury abilities throughout the games, he has his own signatures to draw from.

But in the end, that's all opinion-based. So I won't vote for now, since considering the mindset shown above, the other characters won't be receiving much support thanks to Alex, and my vote won't make a difference here for now. :/

Felix is a fine choice, but I'd still prefer Alex. No other character is as important as those two however, and yes, the other Adepts do serve supporting roles. The only other possibilities are the pairs of antagonists from each game (Saturos&Menardi for example), but then picking one of those pairs over the other games pairs wouldn't make sense when we can have Alex, the antagonist and manipulator of all three.
Supporting role: "being a fairly important but not leading part, esp. in a play or film".

Ness_64 wrote:

Quote :

The reason to pick Felix however would be his main protagonist role in the third and most recent game. The other Adepts are all supporting characters with very little importance by comparison.

wut
Felix is the second game's protagonist. The third game's one is Matthew, Isaac's son. Felix is actually disappeared on the third one; even though he helped, he went down in history as a villain due to previous actions IIRC.

And I can accept that with FF, since you have valid arguments about WoL. But don't make other characters seem unimportant in Felix's favor. I just can't and won't consider your opinion in anything about this subject at all if you do that.

They're called Warriors of Vale in the third for a reason. Guess which one?
If you want to pick an unimportant one by that logic, pick Kraden, since he only provides helpful information, nothing else.

Each one of the characters have their own story and importance to the plot, and aren't just supporting roles as you say. Everyone needs mutual help, and that includes the main characters. Otherwise their journey is pretty much impossible to complete.
Even the lighthouses, key points of the 2 GBA games and maybe the DS game, require adepts of their respective elements to go through them story-wise. This is even the main reason Alex, Saturos and Menardi were using Felix in the first place, and were planning to do so with Sheba. Actually, I think they did so too, since just to enter Venus Lighthouse you need Reveal Psynergy (something from a Jupiter Adept) IIRC.

I'd like a different Adept, and not an Unfought one (even if the villain, Alex's case). Alex is cool and has relevance, but that's it. You'd need to borrow common Psynergy from Mercury Adepts just to make a moveset for him, and he would be purely centered on that.

But in the end, that's all opinion-based. So I won't vote for now, since considering the mindset shown above, the other characters won't be receiving much support thanks to Alex, and my vote won't make a difference here for now. :/

thank you for kinda backing me up.

I agree that I would say felix is a good choice to except for the fact that an earth adept is already being included in super smash bros crusade: ISAAC (that wasnt directed at you, but in general) therefore, an adept from another element where we KNOW HOW THEY FIGHT IN BATTLE to be a DLC character

- I find it amusing how you compare Alex with Ganondorf with this "argument", while Ganondorf has a lot of things on his own actually shown, unlike Alex. Plus, when did I tell "series antagonist, that's it"?

- He has relevance, but not variety. Isn't variety the primary thing DLC characters are actually going for?
You'll limit yourself with Mercury Psynergy (not even classes, just the - possibly - default Psynergy) if you work with him, since he doesn't actually show anything else. Anything you pull off for him outside of that will be just things he never actually did. IIRC, he never even shows an actual weapon. Good luck with that.
If you want a character whose abilities are shown in 3 or so cutscenes with exactly 1 signature ability (the weak geysers are actually usable, you even put them in Isaac's moveset, I believe), go ahead. You are going against the primary purpose of DLC (offer nice variety to the game) just for the hell of it. Thanks.

- From what I know, in a JRPG game, every character you happen to play as is a main character in some way or another.
Supporting roles in these games are taken on by people helping from the sidelines, but never actually doing something too relevant. Kraden fits perfectly in this description.

- I won't repeat that again: Yes, I believe Isaac/Felix's friends are as important as them, and I have some good reasons for that.
The main one is above: Without them, Isaac's (and by extension, Felix's) quest would be impossible in the first place. And you play as everyone. How they aren't as important as Isaac or Felix? Both of them (or just Isaac, I actually forgot) just happen to be chosen by The Wise One, and any extra relevance to the plot they have is only thanks to him if you look.

And that's not like, say, playing as Sonic and Tails or just one of them in classic Sonic games. You can still beat the game with them, together or alone. In FF games too, it's possible to solo entire games in the series (though hard). This isn't the case with Golden Sun. I think you can still solo the game battle-wise, but every Adept's abilities are required for most of the game. Story-wise, they have a lot of relevance too.

- Informed Ability Spam attacks again... Oh well...

- DLC's primary purpose in any game IS variety. You download content unique to the game, often paying for that. If you can see that in the game, what's the point of downloading it then? There are no exceptions to this. Don't try to say otherwise, a large number of games (if not every game) having DLC shows this.

- Other Adepts can do as much as Isaac as well, while being very different in playstyle. They have their own weapons, can use weapon unleashes, everyone playable can equip Djinn and summon as well, and thanks to that, they can potentially use every Psynergy element. So, they can do as much as Isaac, but in a different AND more unique way in playstyle.
We even have two Mercury Adepts, who can do anything listed on the link you posted, and even they have their own differences themselves.
How other Adepts don't have variety and how I'm contradicting myself?

- Actually, in FFX the protagonist role is divided between Tidus and Yuna. The story even shows Tidus as a "supporting character" - like Vaan in XII, but unlike Vaan, he's relevant -, because he helps Yuna in her entire quest and the entire party's main objective is about Yuna completing her pilgrimage. IIRC, he joined because the destination is the exact place he needs to go to (Zanarkand). And for most of the game, Tidus is telling the story himself.
Thanks for showing a game where multiple characters can be "main protagonists" by your own logic, you just proved my argument as true too.
They even put both of them in Dissidia 012 as playable, further pushing that as true...

- I told supporting characters aren't TOO relevant. That means, as relevant as the characters you play as. Kraden never actually fights alongside the warriors (he's a scholar himself, he just wants to study), but always gives a lot of helpful information essential to their quest.

- Show me every unique Alex's ability then. If you can do it, why didn't you do so earlier? I don't believe everyone here played all Golden Sun games. You listed exactly 1 unique ability (that could potentially break the game if following your description, to top it off) and that was one I saw in a cutscene, so where are the others?

^^^^^

Exactly why I want Ivan Garet and Mia as DLC as Isaac is already in the game for sure

Ness_64 wrote:

- Informed Ability Spam attacks again... Oh well...

- DLC's primary purpose in any game IS variety. You download content unique to the game, often paying for that. If you can see that in the game, what's the point of downloading it then? There are no exceptions to this. Don't try to say otherwise, a large number of games (if not every game) having DLC shows this.
No, DLC is not simply for getting the most unique characters possible. If it were, our current top 16 would be very different, and important series such as Pokemon and Zelda wouldn't be reserved a slot regardless of their winner's uniqueness.

- Other Adepts can do as much as Isaac as well, while being very different in playstyle. They have their own weapons, can use weapon unleashes, everyone playable can equip Djinn and summon as well, and thanks to that, they can potentially use every Psynergy element. So, they can do as much as Isaac, but in a different AND more unique way in playstyle.
We even have two Mercury Adepts, who can do anything listed on the link you posted, and even they have their own differences themselves.
How other Adepts don't have variety and how I'm contradicting myself?
They are no more unique than Alex is. In fact, less unique because they are simply other Adepts, while Alex is nearly an Alchemist. Alex wins on the uniqueness factor there.

- Actually, in FFX the protagonist role is divided between Tidus and Yuna. The story even shows Tidus as a "supporting character" - like Vaan in XII, but unlike Vaan, he's relevant -, because he helps Yuna in her entire quest and the entire party's main objective is about Yuna completing her pilgrimage. IIRC, he joined because the destination is the exact place he needs to go to (Zanarkand). And for most of the game, Tidus is telling the story himself.
Thanks for showing a game where multiple characters can be "main protagonists" by your own logic, you just proved my argument as true too.
They even put both of them in Dissidia 012 as playable, further pushing that as true...
No, the protagonist is Tidus, as by the end you see the story is really about Tidus and what he actually is. Yuna's appearance in Dissidia is irrelevant, otherwise you would be implying Gabranth, Gilgamesh, Tifa, Kain, Shantotto, and Laguna are all primary protagonists.

- I told supporting characters aren't TOO relevant. That means, as relevant as the characters you play as. Kraden never actually fights alongside the warriors (he's a scholar himself, he just wants to study), but always gives a lot of helpful information essential to their quest.
I've already shown you how this is not true. A supporting character is an important character second only to the main protagonist. Mia, Garet and Ivan fit that description perfectly.

- Show me every unique Alex's ability then. If you can do it, why didn't you do so earlier? I don't believe everyone here played all Golden Sun games. You listed exactly 1 unique ability (that could potentially break the game if following your description, to top it off) and that was one I saw in a cutscene, so where are the others?

Alex's powers:
- Anything Mercury
- Presumably anything Jupiter or Venus as well due to his event with the Golden Sun, and most Mars abilities though that is the one lighthouse he did not attain full power from
Already he has more than any other character. As for his signatures, here's what the wiki says:

Quote :

At any rate, by the present day and age, Alex appears to have mastered an array of very advanced and powerful Psynergy abilities no other Adept in the series seems able to use, including self-levitation that borders on flight, summoning powerful geysers out of the ground that can shoot objects heavy as human bodies far up and away into the sky, and the ability that can be considered his unofficial "trademark", the Warp. He can instantly disappear in a flash of light, remain in an apparently invisible state for either a moment or a while, and then reappear elsewhere in a location that may be a good distance away from his previous location, and he can warp himself along with another person accompanying him so that both individuals can disappear, travel, and reappear together.

I voted Alex as he's the only one I recognize with any relevency (Besides Felix who uses the same abilities as Isaac). I haven't played Golden Sun, but couldn't Alex just use any water ability (Thus having anything Mia or Piers would have)?

RoyMaster4 wrote:

I voted Alex as he's the only one I recognize with any relevency (Besides Felix who uses the same abilities as Isaac). I haven't played Golden Sun, but couldn't Alex just use any water ability (Thus having anything Mia or Piers would have)?

Exactly. Anything they could do and more. The only uniqueness that could be attributed to the other Mercury Adepts are Weapon Unleashes, but Alex has much more going for him than that. Unleashes also aren't character specific, but weapon specific.