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 Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)

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Maikeru
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PostSubject: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:52 am

According to two hardened smash brother players who dumped the brawl info on their computer to see through the information, the following characters were planned but cut out of the game's roster although their information are on the brawl disc. The following are:

-Doctor Mario
-Mewtwo
-Roy
-Dixie kong
-Plusle & Minun
-Toon Zelda

The reason I posted this on crusade is because that even though we got Dixie, Roy, Mewtwo, and Doctor Mario: Toon Zelda and Plusle/Minun are two characters not on the roster. Does this regard as veterans status or not? If so, should we add them to the roster or have them planned somewhere in the game?

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Sparlock



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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Wed Aug 29, 2012 1:28 am

I doubt it, that code has been known for ages, and it really is the smallest trace of the characters. I vaguely remember hearing there were Tetra files too for Toon Zelda. Also I heard that Plu/Min was designed as a replacement for the Ice Climbers, but they ended up staying.

There's more code in Brawl for Trophies, Pokeball's and Assist Trophies, it doesn't mean that we should call all of them "Vet's" people can glitch their way into playing Master Hand, but we can't add him either.
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Dr.MarioX
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:12 am

Just go here for information about anything left over on Brawl's disc. Thank you.


Last edited by Dr.MarioX on Wed Aug 29, 2012 2:32 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Something went awfully wrong with the link...)
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Wed Aug 29, 2012 6:41 am

There are no Tetra files, only Toon Sheik. Even though there was no Toon Sheik in the Zelda series, Sakurai apparently found Sheik to be important to Zelda's character that he was willing to give a 2nd Zelda her own version of Sheik.

As for Pra_Mai, we don't know for absolute fact if it was Plusle & Minun or not. There are great points to support it, as well as points against it.

And for fun fact, Dixie was not intended to be a seperate character; only a tag-team partner to Diddy.

But no. Scrapped characters don't count as veterans. If you were drafted in the military during World War II, but not sent into combat, would you be considered a war veteran? No.
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Dr.MarioX
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Wed Aug 29, 2012 2:34 pm

Quote :
References to Cut Characters

It's no surprise that many characters would be cut from the roster, considering the number of characters in the final version. Unfortunately, the only hint that these characters might have been considered to be in the game are their effects files and internal references[1]. The exceptions are Mewtwo and Roy, who also have an unused victory fanfare. Like with the cut enemies, the effects files are all empty.

roy (from Melee)
toon_zelda
toon_sheik (possibly Tetra)
dr_mario (again, from Melee)
dixie (another Kong)
mewtwo (Melee, again)
pra_mai (speculated to stand for Plusle and Minun; they are referred to as Prasle and Minun everywhere in the game's code)

References to debug characters


Located at 0x80B0A6D8 in memory (NTSC-U), the string /fighter/mariod/FitMarioD.pac is found, yet left unused, which refers to a debug version of (not surprisingly) Mario. He also has his own Character Slot[2] (0x32), while the 7 removed characters have not, suggesting MarioD was removed much later in development.
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Bloody Gallade
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Wed Aug 29, 2012 6:24 pm

Just because they were considered and may have leftovers, doesn't mean they are veterans in any sense of the word. Either way, Toon Shiek would be like adding Ice Pikachu. She doesn't exist. This is made worse with the existance of Tetra. As for Plusle and Minun, we don't know if Praimai is plusle and minun, and even if it is, they were cut for a reason: likely because they were a pants on head retarded idea from the get-go.
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Wed Aug 29, 2012 6:25 pm

I wouldn't say that. They would've made perfect sense to be Pichu replacements like Toon Link was for Young Link.
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Maikeru
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Wed Aug 29, 2012 9:48 pm

Bloody Gallade wrote:
Just because they were considered and may have leftovers, doesn't mean they are veterans in any sense of the word. Either way, Toon Shiek would be like adding Ice Pikachu. She doesn't exist. This is made worse with the existance of Tetra. As for Plusle and Minun, we don't know if Praimai is plusle and minun, and even if it is, they were cut for a reason: likely because they were a pants on head retarded idea from the get-go.

Actually, plusle and minun could be unique characters. Let me explain why:

First off, down B would have been volt switch. Plusle would cause a shock barrier then switch off with Minun. The same could be done vice versa.

Also, had plusle and minun had different specials and a difference between them in normal/smash attacks (unlike the ice climbers which perform exactly everything the same) while having the partner follow the player: this would actually have been fun and unique tag team characters for smash brothers brawl. It would totally work

But now on a serious note: Everybody agrees that it doesn't count as vet status of course but can we atleast have them planned for CrusaDLC rather than "vote now"? I mean sure their information was barely complete or worked on at all but maybe it would be fair if we place them in crusade in some way
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Smash King
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Wed Aug 29, 2012 9:58 pm

So that everyone knows, Plusle & Minum use to be on the Pokemon DLC Poll. Apparently, they lost to Meowth & Deoxys. They only had 1 vote (which was supported by DMX Troll).
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:29 pm

Maikeru wrote:
Bloody Gallade wrote:
Just because they were considered and may have leftovers, doesn't mean they are veterans in any sense of the word. Either way, Toon Shiek would be like adding Ice Pikachu. She doesn't exist. This is made worse with the existance of Tetra. As for Plusle and Minun, we don't know if Praimai is plusle and minun, and even if it is, they were cut for a reason: likely because they were a pants on head retarded idea from the get-go.

Actually, plusle and minun could be unique characters. Let me explain why:

First off, down B would have been volt switch. Plusle would cause a shock barrier then switch off with Minun. The same could be done vice versa.

Also, had plusle and minun had different specials and a difference between them in normal/smash attacks (unlike the ice climbers which perform exactly everything the same) while having the partner follow the player: this would actually have been fun and unique tag team characters for smash brothers brawl. It would totally work

But now on a serious note: Everybody agrees that it doesn't count as vet status of course but can we atleast have them planned for CrusaDLC rather than "vote now"? I mean sure their information was barely complete or worked on at all but maybe it would be fair if we place them in crusade in some way
We already have two bloody Pokemon as DLC, we don't need another!
And you don't know how P+M would have worked, so don't act as if you did.
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Maikeru
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Thu Aug 30, 2012 12:37 am

Octavio wrote:

We already have two bloody Pokemon as DLC, we don't need another!
And you don't know how P+M would have worked, so don't act as if you did.
I didn't act like I did. It was a moveset idea. Calm down Octavio
And ok. We do have two pokemon for crusaDLC. You made your point there.. But what about Toon Zelda?

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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Thu Aug 30, 2012 7:23 am

"First off, down B would have been volt switch. Plusle would cause a shock barrier then switch off with Minun. The same could be done vice versa.

Also, had plusle and minun had different specials and a difference between them in normal/smash attacks (unlike the ice climbers which perform exactly everything the same) while having the partner follow the player: this would actually have been fun and unique tag team characters for smash brothers brawl. It would totally work."

As for Toon Zelda, no. We should not give a Newcomer clone that was scrapped automatic DLC just because she was planned to be in Brawl at some point.
Toon Zelda will have equal chance with other Zelda DLC, and currently, Skull Kid is dominating the poll.
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HawlSera
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sat Feb 02, 2013 6:34 pm

Personally I think it's hypocritical to put Dixie Kong in, but not Toon Zelda and Tetra. Just sayin'.
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sat Feb 02, 2013 6:37 pm

Learn the definition of "hypocritical", and I might take you seriously.
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HawlSera
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sat Feb 02, 2013 7:06 pm

Just saying, Dixie is getting in and in her original role despite being cut. And yet, for the same reason Dixie is being added, Toon Zelda is being kept out? I think both should be out of crusade or both should be put in. No middle ground.

As for Plusle and Minun, frankly I'm amazed they were even considered for Brawl as a whopping zero people give enough of a damn about Blue and Red Pichus. Now THAT might be hypocritical of me in it's purest definition, but I still stand by this and go onto to say that it would involve designing a moveset for characters that literally no one cares about whilst Dixie and Toon Zelda's movesets write themseles. I see Tetra as being a Luigi of Toon Link with the grappling hook and slingshot in place of hookshot and bow. Oh and of course Pirate Scimitar inplace of a Sword and Shield. Toon Zelda having her own moveset which moreso revolves around abilities she actually used, like light arrows.
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sat Feb 02, 2013 7:15 pm

HawlSera wrote:
Just saying, Dixie is getting in and in her original role despite being cut. And yet, for the same reason Dixie is being added, Toon Zelda is being kept out? I think both should be out of crusade or both should be put in. No middle ground.

Mind explaining why you feel this way?
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sat Feb 02, 2013 7:16 pm

this thread doesn't even directly involve crusade and the last post was in august of last year what are you doing
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MercuryHg34



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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sat Feb 02, 2013 7:29 pm

yeah cool =)
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HawlSera
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sat Feb 02, 2013 9:30 pm

Mr. Mistress wrote:
HawlSera wrote:
Just saying, Dixie is getting in and in her original role despite being cut. And yet, for the same reason Dixie is being added, Toon Zelda is being kept out? I think both should be out of crusade or both should be put in. No middle ground.

Mind explaining why you feel this way?

Certainly, I'm a writer and my policy is "Go Big or Go Home". I feel like if you're going to do something you have to go all the way. Ressurecting all of the cut characters from Brawl, including Dixie and not including Toon Zelda just seems half-assed.

Plus, the whole "Well, Toon Zelda and Plusle and Minun weren't actually in Brawl, just considered" excuse just seems pulled right out of the donkey when in the final version of Brawl, Diddy was not partnered with Dixie. The idea was merely "considered"

I'm willing to cut Plusle and Minun some slack because, like I said I'm amazed that even got to the drawing board.

I'm not barking orders, I just felt it needed to be said, keeping Toon Zelda out, but putting Dixie in just feels half-assed. That said I am still looking forward to the final version of the game and enjoy the current product, which is far less half-assed than most Nintendo games that come out these days. I am also super grateful since I have my main back (Mewtwo). Right now I'm esctatic in waiting for Bowser Jr, Weegee, and King K. Rool (he's on the roster right?)
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Slissith



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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sun Feb 03, 2013 5:06 am

I think dixie is being added mostly due to the fact that is important to the series as well as the fact that was she partnered with diddy in one game.

Whatsmore, the DK series is in lack of representatives as of now, compared to other series, such as zelda and especially pokemon.

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MercuryHg34



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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sun Feb 03, 2013 8:31 am

Dr. Mario, Mewtwo and Roy are alll melee vets, they are auto-main roster.

Dixie is being added for the reasons Slissith mentioned.

None of them are being added because they were planed for brawl, that just happens to be coincidence.
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sun Feb 03, 2013 9:08 am

Difference between Dixie and Toon Zelda is this:

-Dixie is being added to make what Diddy was originally going to be; a Diddy/Dixie tag-team. She is technically not her own character, though she can be played alone as an alt because Diddy alone is going to be an alt as well to not completely alienate those who preferred Diddy being alone.

-Dixie Kong is a highly requested character for Smash. Toon Zelda is not. That alone makes Dixie Kong more important to add.

-With Toon Zelda, the only absolute we know about her is Toon Zelda herself. The filename for her transformation is "Toon Sheik", so there's a 50/50 chance that it was literally a Toon Sheik, or that it was codename for Tetra. The point; we simply do not know, unlike with Dixie.

-As I said in the Zelda DLC thread, Toon Zelda doesn't make sense, let alone with a transformation, which is why I feel Toon Zelda was scrapped. Think about it; Toon Zelda has no indincation of any magic abilities, and for the most part, she was Tetra throughout her appearance.
With transformation, Toon Sheik would REALLY be out of place, as there's no such thing. As for Tetra, she couldn't transform into Zelda at will and back unlike Sheik. It took King Daphnes' power to "transform" her into her true identity, and the magic wore off when he died.

-If the plan went through like I believe it would have, Toon Zelda/Sheik would have been another clone, and like Toon Link, be one of the "cloniest".


So logically, only Tetra makes sense out of the three, and there is no complete indincation that "Toon Sheik" was her to begin with, leaving the best option to have her voted upon as DLC.
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rjones1325
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Sun Feb 03, 2013 9:45 am

You could vote for Toon Zelda for the DLC
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PostSubject: Re: Hidden information on brawl disc (regarding veterans/newcomers)   Today at 6:48 pm

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