HomePortalCalendarFAQSearchMemberlistUsergroupsRegisterLog in

Share | 
 

 May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
Dr. CanadianBacon
Level 6 CPU


  Waluigi
  829
  Dr.CanadianBacon

PostSubject: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 7:34 am

I don't understand a few things about her.

First, her side smash has little range, and doesn't feel the best option, down smash has more range and seems more powerful.

Second, her dash attack takes really long to stand up, I feel like this should take a bit less long... but I guess it takes so long because it's powerful? Idk.

Third, I think the Neutral B should be like more chargeable attacks, and be allowed to be stored for later... Otherwise it's hard to hit a fully charged attack.

I guess I feel she's underpowered because maybe I'm playing her incorrectly, if I could get some tips, because I really want to get good with her. Razz
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Falcon8r



  Ryu
  786

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 8:36 am

Dr. CanadianBacon wrote:
Third, I think the Neutral B should be like more chargeable attacks, and be allowed to be stored for later... Otherwise it's hard to hit a fully charged attack.

You can store the charge. Just press Shield, and you can move around like normal without losing the charge.

Ashley definitely has some more... specialized attacks. Side Smash has pretty good knockback if you can land it, but I generally stick to Ftilt and Fair for horizontal knockback - and the latter is very good for that since it has good range and speed.

She's also got this mechanic where using Side B or B puts her in a state where you can't use them again for a short time - so just be aware of that.

I think someone's gotta create a guide for her soon - as you said, she seems underpowered at first. However, she definitely has some cheap stuff once you start putting things together.

Back to top Go down
View user profile
Dr. CanadianBacon
Level 6 CPU


  Waluigi
  829
  Dr.CanadianBacon

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 8:47 am

Falcon8r wrote:
Dr. CanadianBacon wrote:
Third, I think the Neutral B should be like more chargeable attacks, and be allowed to be stored for later... Otherwise it's hard to hit a fully charged attack.

You can store the charge. Just press Shield, and you can move around like normal without losing the charge.

Ashley definitely has some more... specialized attacks. Side Smash has pretty good knockback if you can land it, but I generally stick to Ftilt and Fair for horizontal knockback - and the latter is very good for that since it has good range and speed.

She's also got this mechanic where using Side B or B puts her in a state where you can't use them again for a short time - so just be aware of that.

I think someone's gotta create a guide for her soon - as you said, she seems underpowered at first. However, she definitely has some cheap stuff once you start putting things together.


Ah, good to know the ability to store the charge, it'd be weird otherwise.
I also noticed she can move while using side B by jumping, then using it before hitting the ground. She can also do this for down B

Um, another thing I haven't been able to properly use is her down B, the counter. I haven't got a good timing for it yet, it seems really hard to hit. Still trying her out though.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
C_Mill24
Level 9 CPU


  Random
  2071
  C-Mill24

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:50 am

I don't get Ashley's gimmick. It makes no sense and does nothing but hold her back.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Dry



  4607

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:52 am

Ashley still pretty much has the same playstyle from when Det coded her. Very combo-heavy, using utilt, nair, uair and dair. Side B increases the opponent's weight, making the combo last even longer.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Dr. CanadianBacon
Level 6 CPU


  Waluigi
  829
  Dr.CanadianBacon

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:53 am

C_Mill24 wrote:
I don't get Ashley's gimmick. It makes no sense and does nothing but hold her back.

I agree with this. Perhaps I just don't understand it well enough though...
She's a confusing character
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Dry



  4607

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:56 am

Oh I thought I answered that. What did you actually mean by Ashley's gimmick?
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Dr. CanadianBacon
Level 6 CPU


  Waluigi
  829
  Dr.CanadianBacon

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 12:07 pm

Dry wrote:
Oh I thought I answered that. What did you actually mean by Ashley's gimmick?

oops, never saw your post, sorry. But seeing what Side Special does now is a bit nicer. The gimmick is that using Neutral Special and Side Special makes it so you can't use the attack again, it's not to much of a problem I guess... Glad to know Side Special weighs them down, it's still pretty hard to hit though.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Perfect Hell



  Evil Ryu
  8819

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 6:09 pm

Neutral special can hit through shields and causes stun/dizzy, setting your opponent up for combos (something Ashley excels at). Side B increases your opponent's weight, further aiding Ashley's combo game. Side B can also misfire, causing Ashley's weight to increase instead. As a lightweight, this actually helps her survive longer. All in all these specials fit her playstyle quite well.

_________________
Perfect Hell

SSBC Head Character Balancer

SSBC Programmer

SSBC Back Room Founder

SSF2 Back Room Member

Competitive discussion is what I do

Crusade Movesets:  projectcrusade.forumotion.com/t1613-pending-moveset-topic#45702
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Dr. CanadianBacon
Level 6 CPU


  Waluigi
  829
  Dr.CanadianBacon

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 6:21 pm

Perfect Hell wrote:
Neutral special can hit through shields and causes stun/dizzy, setting your opponent up for combos (something Ashley excels at).  Side B increases your opponent's weight, further aiding Ashley's combo game.  Side B can also misfire, causing Ashley's weight to increase instead.  As a lightweight, this actually helps her survive longer.  All in all these specials fit her playstyle quite well.

Ah, thank you for the advice. This is all I really needed to know.
Still confused about the Down Special, why is it so precise? I think it should be a bit buffed and have more hit-frames... or whatever you call them. (counter frames? Idk)
But other than that, thanks for the explaination, this should help out a bit~
Back to top Go down
View user profile
SP



  Crash Bandicoot
  3842
  cellularSP

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 7:27 pm

Lord this really wants me to make those moveset changes I thought of a while back
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Falcon8r



  Ryu
  786

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Sun Sep 28, 2014 8:55 pm

Hm, Ashley still seems like she'll struggle against characters like Toon Link, Marth, Saki, and (especially) Meta Knight - essentially, characters who can match or come close to matching her speed and have better disjointed hitboxes. I found even the CPU Meta Knight to be a problem as her. She really does well when she gets her combo game going, but there's no reason a Meta Knight should ever get hit by her. Neutral Air? MK can just fadeaway Fair or Nair all day and have nothing to fear. Yes, he can occasionally get zapped by her Neutral Special or Side Special, but he can easily glide over them and punish with his glide attack (which is still really good in 0.9). Also, Ashley has very little defense when being juggled outside of her counter or flying away using Up Special (which of course is a big risk), as most of her aerials have poor downward-facing hitboxes. Her only saving grace is that she does have some select moves that work well in close encounters, such as Utilt, Dtilt (with the proper spacing), and Fair. Fair is actually my go-to aerial for her unless I'm using Nair, pretty much.

I think Ashley is actually good, but she has a rough time against most of the old school top-tiers, I think. You guys have any suggestions on how to fight these matchups? I guess for simplicity we could start with MK.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Dry



  4607

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Mon Sep 29, 2014 1:45 am

Haha MK and Ashley. Did not realise how well that fit. (Olsen twins, if you don't get it)

Anyway, use her mobility. She runs very quickly on the ground. Her utilt has decent horizontal range, so try to catch an opponent with that.

Meta Knight seems to be a tough matchup, true, but he's also the weakest character in the game in terms of combo potential and kill power. The damage Ashley can do to MK with a single hit is equivalent to like fifteen of MK's hits. A single opening is all it takes to get a large advantage on him. So basically, don't give up.

Against MK, you really need to be perfect at spacing. The thing with MK is that he can easily outrange you by miles (ftilt, dtilt, dsmash, nair, fair, bair) or use a ridiculously safe and quick move (jab, SL, down B), but never both at once. Ftilt, dtilt and dsmash all have enough end lag for Ashley to run up and utilt. Nair, fair and bair all have long enough duration for Ashley to hit with neutral special if MK whiffs. You need to predict MK's next move and act instantly, because in many cases there are only a couple of frames for you to punish him. If you know the Samus matchup vs Fox in Melee, it's sort of like that; she is able to counter almost everything Fox can do, but Fox is so fast that you pretty much need to act pre-emptively.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
MercuryHg34



  Ridley
  3883

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Mon Sep 29, 2014 6:22 am

Don't forget about Up smash, the longer you charge it the stronger it becomes and the shorter the duration. I usually put one on key spots on the map like near the ledges, on platforms or right in the middle where it obstructs the foe's overall control of the stage. As for kills, land a fully charged Neutral B and use Dsmash, it's her best smash by far. Recovery got nerfed a bit, but if you up B right after your midair jump you'll keep some rising momentum and travel much further than if you wait for the apex of the midair jump to use it.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Falcon8r



  Ryu
  786

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:30 am

Yeah, I know Ashley's speed is her biggest strength, but it's hard when she has no range to speak of with most attacks. DSmash is pretty good for pre-emptively stopping approaches, as is UTilt for a quicker response. I just find it frustrating how easy it is to SDI out of Utilt, even at point-blank range.

Now Dry, that was all great stuff, but then I saw this...

Dry wrote:
Meta Knight seems to be a tough matchup, true, but he's also the weakest character in the game in terms of combo potential and kill power.

I think that's definitely far from true. Sure, Meta Knight doesn't deal damage in individual hits, but he can combo off a Mach Tornado, and also can combo INTO it. That alone gives him 30%+ combos. On the subject of kill power, he's still got glide attack (which is safe by the way), Dimensional Cape, Side Smash, Down Smash and a generally great off-stage game with his aerials... But, I guess that's kind of off-topic since this is the Ashley thread.

Back to top Go down
View user profile
Perfect Hell



  Evil Ryu
  8819

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:58 am

MK can't combo off tornado, your cpu opponents are just failing to escape the followup. That's like the "broken" kirby spark combo that would actually never work.

If Utilt and Nair didnt have high SDI modifiers, then Utilt->Nair repeat would be an utterly broken combo. It used to be that way, and it was awful.

_________________
Perfect Hell

SSBC Head Character Balancer

SSBC Programmer

SSBC Back Room Founder

SSF2 Back Room Member

Competitive discussion is what I do

Crusade Movesets:  projectcrusade.forumotion.com/t1613-pending-moveset-topic#45702
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Dry



  4607

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Mon Sep 29, 2014 1:19 pm

Eh, I'm sure we can talk about MK, so long as we also keep talking about Ashley.

You can't combo into Mach Tornado either. It has 14 frames of startup, and there is no way anything from MK has enough hitstun for that. Also, all of his combo moves (jab, dash attack, dair, fair and bair) do pitiful damage. MK's best method of dealing damage is just to use individual moves; Mach Tornado, usmash and dthrow all do upwards of 20% damage. Even then, they're all unreliable for spacing.

For kill power, MK is still very much the weakest character. Fsmash and the cape can kill at 100%, but they've both got far too much startup. Dsmash's front hit can't even really be called a kill move, and the back hit kills 120% tops. Glide attack shouldn't be killing until 140%. Now you did mention edgeguarding, and MK's actually pretty good at that, but it doesn't help him when he can barely get opponents offstage in the first place.

Anyway, Ashley. If you aren't already, make use of the fact that you can slide with utilt if you use it while dashing.

EDIT: Haha Falcon you were actually right about Mach Tornado. There was a bug that prevented it from making him helpless.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Falcon8r



  Ryu
  786

PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Mon Sep 29, 2014 5:16 pm

Dry wrote:
Eh, I'm sure we can talk about MK, so long as we also keep talking about Ashley.

You can't combo into Mach Tornado either. It has 14 frames of startup, and there is no way anything from MK has enough hitstun for that. Also, all of his combo moves (jab, dash attack, dair, fair and bair) do pitiful damage. MK's best method of dealing damage is just to use individual moves; Mach Tornado, usmash and dthrow all do upwards of 20% damage. Even then, they're all unreliable for spacing.

For kill power, MK is still very much the weakest character. Fsmash and the cape can kill at 100%, but they've both got far too much startup. Dsmash's front hit can't even really be called a kill move, and the back hit kills 120% tops. Glide attack shouldn't be killing until 140%. Now you did mention edgeguarding, and MK's actually pretty good at that, but it doesn't help him when he can barely get opponents offstage in the first place.

Anyway, Ashley. If you aren't already, make use of the fact that you can slide with utilt if you use it while dashing.

EDIT: Haha Falcon you were actually right about Mach Tornado. There was a bug that prevented it from making him helpless.
lol!

Yeah, I get that MK's weak in some respects, but sometimes he still overwhelms when he has the momentum. I can't figure out how I combo'd into MT except maybe with Dair... Which only works at higher %.

Also, yeah, that's good to know about the misfire having some benefit... It's just that it's hard to tell there was a benefit at all without looking it up.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?   Today at 1:50 pm

Back to top Go down
 
May I get a proper explaination on Ashley?
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» Racing with Ashley Sutton
» Racing With Ashley Sutton!
» Professor Ashley Weeks (Reoccurring Character)
» Personal Hygiene/Housekeeping
» Proper Introduction

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
 ::  :: Character Discussion-
Jump to:  
Free forum | © phpBB | Free forum support | Contact | Report an abuse | Free forum