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Which Character(s) Should Represent Fire Emblem?
Alm
0%
 0% [ 0 ]
Celia
13%
 13% [ 3 ]
Lief
0%
 0% [ 0 ]
Eliwood
0%
 0% [ 0 ]
Lyndis
22%
 22% [ 5 ]
Hector
17%
 17% [ 4 ]
Erika
4%
 4% [ 1 ]
Ephraim
22%
 22% [ 5 ]
Chrom
9%
 9% [ 2 ]
Robin (Male)
13%
 13% [ 3 ]
Robin (Female)
0%
 0% [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 23
 

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PostSubject: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 10:47 am

Now I understand that Fire Emblem may not be as popular as other Nintendo series like Mario, The Legend of Zelda, and Poke'mon. BUT WHAT I DO UNDERSTAND is that Fire Emblem still is very popular, and if a series that wasn't even created by Nintendo like Sonic can get 4 main-roster characters AND DLC, then Fire Emblem is due some justice.

So I did my home-work, and I've come up with several characters to represent the games that Marth, Roy and Ike do not:

Fire Emblem Gaiden- Alm/Celia
Fire Emblem Gaiden is the 2nd Fire Emblem game and is a side-story to Fire Emblem Ankoku Ryū to Hikari no Tsurugi (Shadow Dragons and the Blade of Light), the game that Marth is originally from. In Gaiden, Alm shares the "main hero" spotlight with child-hood friend, Princess Celia. Alm is a sword-fighter while Celia is a magician, one of the only 3 lord-characters in Fire Emblem history to not use a sword.

Fire Emblem: Thracia 776- Lief
Also known as Fire Emblem 5, Thracia 776 and its predecessor Fire Emblem; Genealogy of the Holy War were the first games to have a story and setting that are completely unrelated to Marth's story. Although Lief appears in Fire Emblem 4, it's not until Tracia 776 that he is the main hero. Unlike other sword-fighting lords, Lief's fighting style (especially in his DLC for Awakening) is more reflective of a thief or rogue like character. Comparable to Marth, Roy and Ike who have a more "heroic" essence about them.

Fire Emblem (The Blazing Sword)- Elliwood/Lyndis/Hector
Fire Emblem is the first Fire Emblem game to be released outside of Japan. As a prequel to Fire Emblem: The Binding Blade (aka The Sealed Sword), Fire Emblem tells the tale of Roy's father, Elliwood, the Sacaen nomad Lyndis, and Elliwood's child-hood friend Hector. Similar to Celia, Hector is the only lord in Fire Emblem 7 who does not use a sword. Instead he delivers crushing blows with his axe. Elliwood's fighting style is very comparable to that of Marth's, and Lyndis can be seen more of a high-damage/speed-low-defense character.

Fire Emblem The Sacred Stones- Erika/Ephraim
To this day, Fire Emblem 8, The Sacred Stones is the only stand-alone game in Fire Emblem. Princess Erika and Prince Ephraim march onward to the enemy kingdom of Grado to free their homeland of Renais in a dual-storyline campaign, where you can choose to play the game in Erika Mode or Ephraim Mode. Erika is the only lord character who's weapons and fighting style can change significantly between their home-game and their DLC in Awakening. In The Sacred Stones and part 1 of the Awakening DLC, Erika fights similar to Lyndis, in fact, their stat growths are almost identical. In part 3 of the Awakening DLC, Erika assumes a new class, the "Bride." In this form, she sports a lance, bow and magical staff instead of her rapier. Ephraim remains unchanged, however. He is the 3rd lord to not use a sword, and instead carries a lance into battle, fighting similarly to a soldier or knight.

Fire Emblem Awakening- Chrom/Robin
Fire Emblem Awakening is the 13th and most recent game in the Fire Emblem series. The lord character of the game is Chrom, a prince who wields the Falchion, the sword that Marth used ages ago to defeat the Shadow Dragon. When youplay the game, you play as a tactician (The Avatar) whom you can name and customize to optimize stat growths that favor your play style. The Avatar can be either male or female, but either way the default name is Robin. Robin uses elemental magic and a sword.


Essentially, the point of this is that there are non-Nintendo games getting more representation than games that are Ninendo like Fire Emblem. In the poll, "None" is not an option to prevent people from voting for a character and the "none" option, since you can vote for more than one character. If you feel that Fire Emblem should not be represented, simply say so in the thread.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 10:56 am

put anna on this
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 10:59 am

We already had a Fire Emblem DLC poll. Alvis won because deep villain and Giga.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:11 am

Where might I ask? I looked at the official DLC list for all nominated characters and not a single Fire Emblem character was on it.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:12 am

oh right I forgot Alvis.

Yeah, he's on the DLC poll somewhere.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 2:38 pm

Honestly we should consider re-doing that poll, or allowing people to vote whether they want to replace Alvis with a character listed here. I'd much rather have another protagonist than a villain. If we wanted a villain, it should be the villain of Awakening since it's the newest game and smash tradition had Ike enter Brawl as opposed to anyone from FE7 or 8 (since his game was the newest at the time).

EDIT: If we switched to this, the "none" option would need to be added and the poll would have to be restarted without multiple-choice.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 3:07 pm

MercuryHg34 wrote:
smash tradition had Ike enter Brawl as opposed to anyone from FE7 or 8 (since his game was the newest at the time).

There is no Smash tradition.
Roy was NOT the newest character (since his game wasn't even out yet) and he only became considered once Sakurai was adding clones to beef up Melee's roster. He was picked to raise hype for the unreleased game and because his fire sword made him stand out from other options such as Leif, who WAS the newest at the time.

Likewise, Ike was not chosen for being the latest. Sakurai wanted to add a newer (not newest) character, and went to Intelligent Systems for suggestions. They suggested Ike.
If it were soley for the newest, it would have been Micaiah, seeing she was the newest main character for the series prior to Brawl. Either that, or Ike would have been in his Radiant Dawn appearance rather than his Path of Radiance appearance.

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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 3:19 pm

OK, I stand corrected. Doesn't change the fact that there are plenty of better choices than Alvis. Hell, if we really wanted a magician character (the next most popular reason to vote for him was so that we'd have a magic-using FE character) then Celia and Robin would be great choices, or Erika with her new appearance in Awakening. If it had to be a villain, we could pick Nergal from FE7 or Leon from FE8, they are both villains and magicians as well.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 6:48 pm

Wari-O-Matic wrote:
MercuryHg34 wrote:
smash tradition had Ike enter Brawl as opposed to anyone from FE7 or 8 (since his game was the newest at the time).

There is no Smash tradition.
Roy was NOT the newest character (since his game wasn't even out yet) and he only became considered once Sakurai was adding clones to beef up Melee's roster. He was picked to raise hype for the unreleased game and because his fire sword made him stand out from other options such as Leif, who WAS the newest at the time.

Likewise, Ike was not chosen for being the latest. Sakurai wanted to add a newer (not newest) character, and went to Intelligent Systems for suggestions. They suggested Ike.
If it were soley for the newest, it would have been Micaiah, seeing she was the newest main character for the series prior to Brawl. Either that, or Ike would have been in his Radiant Dawn appearance rather than his Path of Radiance appearance.


Wrong.

Marth was in Melee to represent Fire Emblem.
Roy was added to advertise the to-be-released Fire Emblem 6
Ike was added because Sakurai was ordered to remove/replace all clones, and as Merc had said, Ike was the best option over Elliwood, Lyndis, Hector, Erika or Ephraim because he was the newest protagonist. If we were to follow tradition, we should add Chrom or Robin.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 6:52 pm

Remove/Replace all clones

Falco and Ganondorf still there

Toon Link being a clone-ish character

errrrr i have no idea where you get this from christian.

We should just leave it as-is anyway. In my opinion if we were to have another character for FE, it should be Anna or Alvis. Adds some interesting variety.

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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:26 pm

I just want to point out a few things here, particularly why there are several characters who are better options than Alvis.

The two main reasons Alvis made it to DLC were the fact that he's a villain and the fact that he's a magician. There is one character who fits this profile perfectly, yet is from what I believe to be a more popular game than FE4 or 5 on their own: Leon. Leon is the villain of FE8, which to my knowledge is a more popular game than 4 or 5 on their own. Since he is the same as Alvis other than that, he is just simply a better option. He also keeps the trait of repping a FE universe not already repped by Marth (1,2,3,12,13), Roy (6,7) and Ike (9,10) since Leon would rep 8, the only game that doesn't share a universe with other games.

If we wanted to drop adequate representation we could then add Nergal, the magician-villain of FE7. He is identical to Leon and Alvis in that regard, only his game is WAY more popular than any of the games Leon and Alvis come from.

Drop the villain part, and now Celia and Robin both become good choices since they're both spell-swords. Robin is a slightly better choice since the two of them are both from Marth's universe, yet Robin's game is the newest and wisest choice to rep in that case.

Next remove the magician requirement and we still have fairly unique choices, those being Hector and Ephraim. They are both from more popular games than Alvis, yet they still differ from the veteran FE characters in that they don't fight with a sword; Hector wields an axe while Ephraim wields a lance. Ephraim wins over Hector, however, since he reps 8 while Hector reps the universe of 7, already done by Roy.

tl;dr: There are way better candidates for DLC than Alvis since they all surpass him in various aspects that got him onto DLC to begin with. According to what I mentioned above, the best order would look like this imo:

1. Leon
2. Nergal
3. Robin
4. Celia
5. Ephraim
6. Hector
7. Alvis & Friends
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:34 pm

or just ignore all that stuff and remember he's on the poll because people like him. Nothin to do with popularity.

Plus he's just a total badass.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:44 pm

Those were actually reasons that came up to vote for him during the poll's running time. I remember because I voted for him initially.

BTW exactly 7 people "like him" on the DLC poll at this very moment. If you want a FE DLC character, I'd suggest replacing him with one of the characters I pointed out, or at least putting some thought into it as a community.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:46 pm

not too many people here care about fire emblem, so people arent gonna vote for a 'more logical' choice anyway.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:00 pm

At this point it doesn't hurt to try. Worse comes to worse, Alvis stays on the poll exactly as he is and nothing changes. Best case scenario we replace him with a more popular choice and they get overwhelming support.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:01 pm

Alvis didn't get voted for because he's "popular". Alvis got voted for because of campaigning for him using the logic that Mercury has already defeated. That's evidenced by the fact that Alvis was nowhere remotely close to winning until someone started saying Alvis was super unique, and so people changed their votes. As Mercury has shown, that was flawed logic, and even if you want to pull the "it's a popularity contest, not who deserves it" Alvis would still be the weakest link of them all.

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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:03 pm

Why are you guys so dead-set against wanting to remove the guys i worked so hard to get on the polls in the first place?

Ralph, Alvis...

I mean damn, let it alone already. What's done is done.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:09 pm

Well, it has nothing to do with who campaigned for the characters. I could care less if it was you, a random first time poster, or even someone like Jak. I don't actually care about FE either, personally. I'm just pointing out the facts here, I would say Mercury is right.

If it weren't for some of us pushing for changes like these, the recent roster changes wouldn't have happened and you would have Cless in the final game over Klonoa&Heihachi. I doubt many on this forum prefer that. So no, we shouldn't just leave alone bad roster choices.

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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:11 pm

but Alvis isnt a bad choice to everyone who looked at the possible choices.

From what I pointed out about Alvis, he was the most interesting choice and probably the coolest. And godammit he sure as hell is interesting and cool.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:22 pm

Well no, he's not a bad choice. But I also don't see the harm in redoing the poll. If Alvis is that cool and popular, he'll win. If not, then there was a better rep and we get that rep. It's a win no matter what. I would just want to check first if there's even enough support for the running of a new FE poll, i think that's a vote in itself.

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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:26 pm

i don't think that is even possible if he's already on the poll.

the fire emblem guy is already there and he isnt a bad choice. and like i said, no one here really cares much about fire emblem as far as ive seen. But Alvis would be a fine choice for even people who don't care that much. A deep, classic villain with a tragic story and kickass powers of meteor showers and seas of fire

oh so dire
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:26 am

Alvis admittedly is a badass character imo, but that is ultimately a subjective opinion; your definition of a badass character differs from mine, which differs from PH4's, which differs from Golden's, etc.

From what I have seen on these forums, people are easily swayed by inaccurate facts or flawed logic very easily. In this case the logic that lead to Alvis being voted on was not wrong in any way. What I have done is simply show that there are better options than Alvis using the same logic that got him voted onto DLC in the first place. In all honesty, nobody would care about Alvis if it weren't for his "uniqueness factor" which is clearly surpassed completely by Leon, and in several aspects by the others I've listed. And out of those choices so far, the ones who are on the poll are all tied for 1st place (Celia, Robin, Ephraim, Hector). Even Lyndis is tied with them but that is probably just because she is a much more memorable character than most on that poll anyway.

Azure, restart the poll and make it a simple Yes/No as to whether the community would like to replace Alvis on the DLC poll or keep him. If No wins then he stays, if Yes wins we put together a new list of characters to vote on.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:02 am

Guess who's back; it's Dr. FE!!!

First of all, clearing something up from the OP, Cellica/Celia does use swords. Although most people use her as a mage, story-wise her sword is supposed to be her main weapon, and she has her own unique sword-attack animation. Of course, Sevr is a far superior swordsman and Cellica's the only good mage until Sonia, so most people use her as a mage anyway.

Also, it would be unwise to have Cellica without having Arum (or Alm, foreign spellings blah). Yes they are both technically the protagonists, but Arum is the one to start with, the one to finish off the final boss and Cellica isn't even playable from about halfway through the last part until the final chapter. Arum has many of the FE protagonist "staple" features that Cellica doesn't -- he has his own super sword (Falchion) unlike Cellica, he has his own anti-armour-and-cavalry sword (Royal Sword) unlike Cellica, and he even has the only critical animation in the game. I suggest Cellica should be taken off the poll, because there shouldn't even be the possibility of her making it and Arum not. It would be like Micaiah being in Brawl without Ike.

Meanwhile, I agree with Giga on the Alvis thing. People voted for him, and to be honest there was nothing hyperbolic about Giga's advertising. What I want to know from Giga, though, is which Alvis we want. Sage Alvis uses only magic but is more agile, Emperor Alvis can use swords but is clad in armour. Nothing is stopping us from combining the two, so that's an option.
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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Fri Feb 15, 2013 8:49 am

Alvis is staying where he is, what's done is done. There is no reason to take him off at all, especially since he adds a Villain to FE (if he won).

Alvis would probably fight with everything he's used. Just his pure badassness is enough lol.

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PostSubject: Re: Fire Emblem   Fri Feb 15, 2013 10:16 am

AzureLight12 wrote:


Wrong.

Marth was in Melee to represent Fire Emblem.
Roy was added to advertise the to-be-released Fire Emblem 6
Ike was added because Sakurai was ordered to remove/replace all clones, and as Merc had said, Ike was the best option over Elliwood, Lyndis, Hector, Erika or Ephraim because he was the newest protagonist. If we were to follow tradition, we should add Chrom or Robin.

"Sakurai was ordered to remove/replace all clones"? That is complete horseshit.
Are you seriously suggesting that the man in-charge of the series and the character roster as a whole was given ORDERS by someone else in regards to characters?
That's very laughable. Especially when you consider that Ganondorf and Falco were neither replaced nor removed and that Roy and Dr. Mario have character data within the disk. Oh, are you going to state that they are "exceptions", now? That would imply you have no idea what in the Hell you are talking about.

Aside from that, Sakurai actually stated within Famitsu that Ike was under Intelligent System suggestion when he asked them about a newer character to include. Information courtesy of ChronoBound of SmashBoards, who is a reliable source when it comes to Japanese speculation and information.
I don't say things without a source backing me up. I suggest you do the same unless you want me to call you out.
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